Some fabulous Schizoid Disorder information...

[Niflheimian]

http://www.geocities.com/ptypes/schizoidpd.html
I'm not attempting to diagnose myself, but this describes me very accurately.

Here's another: http://www.toad.net/~arcturus/dd/schizoid.htm

What do you think?

[booyalab]

I've been the first person to post on the last 3 new threads. Isnt that special? I think INTPs are only a weak version of the Schizoid disorder. You probably wouldn't start a thread inquiring about other people's opinions on this topic if you were abnormally withdrawn. Also, people with mental problems tend to not be able to look at it objectively on their own.

[booyalab]

er.......the second..? does the initial post by the person who made it count? ok i was the first to reply

[Niflheimian]

You probably wouldn't start a thread inquiring about other people's opinions on this topic if you were abnormally withdrawn. Also, people with mental problems tend to not be able to look at it objectively on their own.

Actually, I would (going on the premise that I probably have the disorder). The internet eliminates most of my anxiety due to the lack of face-to-face confrontation. I'm also very introspective, whether that's a characteristic of the disorder or not; I know myself well. Perhaps I merely have a low form of the disorder, but the description(s) is surprisingly accurate. I'm not going to discard the possibility because of minute differences. And in a sense you're correct: I probably would not ask anyone about this face-to-face, or in a similar situation; I suppose, for me, that's what the internet is for. I'm also curious (about certain things, mind you), whether or not that means anything...[/rant]

[Hypnos]

I think the negative aspects of my schizoidism are balanced by my narcissism, so the net effect is "asshole." :)

[snarled]

"If I know I'm going crazy, I must not be insane" - Dave Mustaine (Megadeth)

[CosmicDust]

I don't have schizoid personality disorder. I experience pleasure and emotion, am responsive to praise and especially to criticism, and reducing the compulsive message board habit seems like it would take some inner struggle. To some (offline at least) I might resemble a schizoid on the surface, if they don't catch me crying or nearly crying when something has prompted my superego to crack the whip on me again.

[EternalCynic]

After reading the first over.. does it really need to be identified as a mental illness? I suppose maybe in extreme cases, but honestly.. belief in UFO's and being disagreeable constitutes as being mentally unhealthy? I must be completely off my rocker. :thumbdow:

[CosmicDust]

Those might have been general (exaggerated) characteristics of the Big Five dimensions, not of Schizoid Personality Disorder. That's how I interpreted them, anyway.

For what it's worth, I don't believe in UFO's, and though I'm not disagreeable, I'm not very empathic either. I'm a soft T, but a clear T nonetheless.

[Jezebel]

I'm not and it doesn't sound appealing to me.


Desires/Pleasures
solitude
isolation
autonomy
detachment
being alone
mobility
independence
solitary pursuits
making decisions by oneself
carrying out solo activities
not getting involved
freedom of action
keeping one's distance
sexual pleasure
knowledge
competency
privacy
leisure

I can relate to many things on this list ~sometimes~ with ~most~ people, but I don't think I take any of them to extremes. I enjoy my solitude and freedom but I also truely do enjoy and care about other people too.


Fears/Distresses
intimacy
being involved in a group
other people (because they are intrusive)
closeness
close relationships
being encumbered by other people
being encumbered by employment
actions by others that represent encroachment
close encounters
having to share decision making
showing feelings
sexual experiences with others
social responsibilities

I can't say that anything on that list bothers me.

[cloakable]

Okay, I have most of the traits on the list, but why label them a disorder? Is it going to affect others? This smacks of SJ thinking. 'We are the Guardian's. Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated into normal society.'

[EternalCynic]

Okay, I have most of the traits on the list, but why label them a disorder? Is it going to affect others? This smacks of SJ thinking. 'We are the Guardian's. Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated into normal society.'

My thinking exactly.

[Chaos Symphony]

I'm somewhere between being avoidant and schizoid, it seems, but I think my expression of the latter is more of a consequence of being avoidant than the schizoid disorder in itself. The fears/distresses listed above are all things that I shy away from, but I do so for reasons which match the AvPD pattern. Irrational fear of judgment and rejection. I think the key difference may be that I'm not /unable/ to be responsive around other people, I just willfully detach myself in order to avoid being paralyzed by fear. And in the same vein, I take pleasure in solitary pursuits because those do not induce the stress of suppression and doubt.

[greenintp]

No.
Paranoid maybe. But, schizoid...no

[Nindy]

I'm somewhere between being avoidant and schizoid, it seems, but I think my expression of the latter is more of a consequence of being avoidant than the schizoid disorder in itself. The fears/distresses listed above are all things that I shy away from, but I do so for reasons which match the AvPD pattern. Irrational fear of judgment and rejection. I think the key difference may be that I'm not /unable/ to be responsive around other people, I just willfully detach myself in order to avoid being paralyzed by fear. And in the same vein, I take pleasure in solitary pursuits because those do not induce the stress of suppression and doubt.

I seem to be somewhere in between as well, I can relate completely to both of the disorder-descriptions. Although I'm not sure whether my avoidant side is what causes my schizoidness or not, still need to figure that out for me.

[Boneca]

I don't know what to think of this. Honestly, I don't think anyone who didn't know me would believe I'm schizoid, because I have learned reasonable social skills and do not appear shy in any way.
But when it comes to how I think, the schizoid description is spot on. "I don't care, I just look like I do" - that is me.

Funny thing, I think both my parents may be schizoid too (I am an only child). We are a very happy family, but I could actually imagine that outsiders would think we are weird. F.ex. the last time I can remember my mum inviting someone home that she wasn't related to, I was five years old. My dad doesn't work, so he can go for weeks without speaking to anyone but my mum, but it doesn't bother him or us.
Heh, this requires some thinking about.

I still stand by the opinion that in that case I have a Schizoid personality, not a schizoid personality disorder. I'm not ill!

[Bad Christian]

The internet eliminates most of my anxiety due to the lack of face-to-face confrontation.

Eh? If it's anxiety that stops you from learning about people, then it's more likely that you have an avoidant personality disorder. Both seem to come with the INTP personality type to some degree, but if you have the schizoid personality disorder, I feel sorry for you. You're like a zombie.


I'm somewhere between being avoidant and schizoid, it seems, but I think my expression of the latter is more of a consequence of being avoidant than the schizoid disorder in itself

That's more similiar to what I think I have.

I really don't like these descriptions of schizoid much, either. Seems to me more like they take one extreme example of an avoidant INTP and describe him/her. The description is basically just of an extremely introverted, cerebral person - an extreme INTP(INTJ?). I'm not sure where the perfectionism and unrealistic expectations stems from, but I've read that those tends of things tend to be common in INTPs.

The rest is just a simple description of an introverted person, which should not be considered the same as a schizoid person. A schizoid person finds the human race rather alien, they return the feeling.

Maybe I'm just confusing myself. But I've never heard of schizoid people being "oversensitive" or "self-conscious", as these sites seem to describe them. That's the opposite of what being schizoid means. Schizoid people don't care what people think. Criticism and people's opinions of them don't matter.

This describes the difference pretty welll, reading over it closer:


However, if the apparent lack of overt interpersonal anxiety is covertly experienced, the differentiation between the schizoid personality disorder and the avoidant personality disorder becomes substantially more problematic. The schizoid personality disorder is currently defined by the absence of affect, inability to experience pleasure, and low involvement with others. Individuals with avoidant personality disorder may control affect, withdraw from pleasurable activities and avoid others in the name of anxiety management. Both may seek isolation, but individuals with schizoid personality disorder will tolerate the separation with comfort and individuals with avoidant personality disorder will be distressed and lonely. If Millon's view is accurate, individuals with avoidant personality disorder will evidence greater agitation and subjective discomfort. Individuals with schizoid personality disorder will not indicate dissatisfaction with isolation. It would appear that clinically there is support for this view. Individuals with a schizoid personality disorder rarely seek treatment; individuals with avoidant personality disorders often do.

I suppose it's pretty possible to be affected by both, to different degrees. I've overcome my avoidant personality, but I'm still slightly withdrawn. I wouldn't tack the schizoid label on myself, though. A personality disorder becomes a personality disorder when one has trouble functioning in life because of it.

[Miss Anthropic]

We INTPs are not warm and fuzzy and thrilled by lots of social interaction, but not necessarily to the degree of disfunction. All humans exhibit behaviors on a spectrum. The behavior doesn't become a mental disorder unless it completely interferes with life. Do you have a job? Go to school? Have a friend? Express annoyance or anger? Diagnose yourself? I have spent too many years feeling disfunctional and anti-social and I'm thrilled to find a website where everybody's feeling and behaviors fall into the same general area of the big spectrum of human behaviors. I can definitely relate to the schizoid laundry list...but I don't experience them to the degree that I can't function. I would rather have schizoid tendencies than a borderline personality disorder...that is probably an S problem :)

[Chicken]

prefering mechanical or abstract tasks, showing little interest in having sexual experiences with another person, maintaining an indifference to the approval and criticism or others, not responding appropriately to social cues.

while this may seem true, i don't respond on the outside, however on the inside the response is often much more intense than i'd like it to be at all.. especially when i get the feeling i'm in a place where i just don't belong, and i will feel to sit alone for a while in a corner.. and just focus on something, like the print dots and patterns on a coke machines side print out board..or the way the little ice cubes are glistening.. it takes my mind off of getting an intense feeling of just not belonging with the atmosphere.. it's a really crappy feeling, and probably associated with APD more than anything..



# intimacy
# being involved in a group
# other people (because they are intrusive)
# closeness
# close relationships
# being encumbered by other people
# being encumbered by employment
# actions by others that represent encroachment
# close encounters
# having to share decision making
# showing feelings
# sexual experiences with others
# social responsibilities


all apply, except it only seems this way to an onlooker.. i often long for things like friendship and feel very lonely anywhere i go.. i don't get involved in groups because i feel totally inadequate and like my opinions and ideas are absolute rubbish(probably because they are, and when i get nervous i spout off a lot of BS because i feel totally pressured to talk), if i am involved i never speak and let people assume i am stupid rather than having myself prove it by interacting.. showing feelings.. well, it's logical to avoid showing feelings when people for the most part tend to manipulate feelings.. and to add to this, i have little or no interest in sex.. unless i was in an intimate relationship, then i see sex as rewarding, because it'd be something mutual shared between myself and a partner.. but it doesn't seem appealing as a one sided activity without emotional involvement, really..

i don't see how any of this is really a Problem as they say..

shit, if someone was sitting there telling me i had all these messed up issues simply for being a very sensitive person, i'd slap it at them as logical to say things like this:


# It doesn't matter what other people think of me.
# It is important for me to be free and independent of others.
# I enjoy doing things more by myself than with other people.
# In many situations, I am better off to be left alone.
# I am not influenced by others in what I decide to do.
# Intimate relations with other people are not important to me.
# I set my own standards and goals for myself.
# My privacy is much more important to me than closeness to people.
# What other people think doesn't matter to me.
# I can manage things on my own without anybody's help.
# It's better to be alone than to feel "stuck" with other people.
# I shouldn't confide in others.
# I can use other people for my own purposes as long as I don't get involved.
# Relationships are messy and interfere with freedom (362).

after quite a bit of counseling and all, my counselor narrowed it down to this..
"since you are introverted and intuitive, it's not very likely you will ever find many people to relate to here."
and that has proven true so far.. i feel very out of place, even in my own family.. they scream often, and i have extremely sensitive hearing.. which conflicts sometimes, but i still care for them a great deal, and i believe showing someone that through actions speaks much more than any voice could ever exclaim. a person can tell you anything you want to hear, but chances are they wont be proving it as readily unless they truly mean what they say.. i don't see the purpose in sharing what i feel verbally, simply because i know very well that it exists, and it's totally obvious to me.. and i know because i base a good bit of decisions on these feelings i get, although they are also backed up by logical thinking much of the time.. it is all proven over time, and mostly never even needs to be said..

of course, i guess someone with a feeling preference would Want it to be said so they could be sure.. but i don't understand the logic in that, really

[s]

Once again... I prefer to think of myself as "delightfully quirky."

[Mountain_Recluse]

Like Niflheimian, I find that most of the descriptors to apply to me.

At the website
http://www.ptypes.com/schizoidpd.html

In "The Disease Perspective" five out of the seven DSM IV traits fit (and only four are necessary for the diagnosis to fit).

Very little in "The Dimensional Perspective" fits except the "Low Extraversion" (and what's wrong with that?), and some of the "Low Conscientiousness" (which is inherent in the "P" part of INTP.) The stuff that does not fit is in "Low Agreeableness", "High Openness", and "High Neuroticism".

Everything in "The Behavior Perspective" fits.

The two lists of "Habitual Passions" in the "The Life Story Perspective" that do not fit Jezebel (from the post above) do all fit me. In the "Cognitive Effects" all fit except the "It doesn't matter what other people think of me." which, especially when it comes to getting and keeping a job, does matter.

All-in-all, yes. As noted in the thread about online personality tests where many of us have posted our scores for various "disorders".
http://www.intpcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1019

My score on that test was 90% for Schizoid. Also 66% for Paranoid and 42% for Avoidant. This too fits according to the following from:
http://www.toad.net/~arcturus/dd/schizoid.htm

"The most frequent co-occurring personality disorders with STP are schizotypal, paranoid, and avoidant personality disorders. SPD is diagnosed more frequently in males who seem to be more impaired than females with SPD (DSM-IV, 1994, p. 639)."

Furthermore, it may very well be largely genetic. Or at least the "nurture" side does pass the traits along. Others have reported experience or history similar to mine. This applies to my family. I believe both my parents were and my sister (my only sibling) is schizoid.I suspect from what I witnessed from my father's family and from what at least my mother told of her family and what I witnessed, that most of my aunts and uncles on both sides were schizoid or at least nearly so. Three died in old age as likely virgin "spinsters" (two on one side, one on the other). Two aunts on each side seemed normal. I had no uncles on my dad's side but the uncles on my mom's side were likely two nearly or actually schizoid and two I dunno. All of my aunts and uncles seemed fairly old even when I was a kid since my mom & dad had me when they were 38 and 37 respectively. Yet even in their forties most seemed, in hindsight, schizoid.

There are a few other threads on this topic:
http://forums.intpcentral.com/showthread.php?t=2684
http://forums.intpcentral.com/showthread.php?t=3745
http://forums.intpcentral.com/showthread.php?t=4655

With the exception of what "others think" (typical INTP), I agree with the following paragraph from:
http://psychcentral.com/psypsych/wiki/Schizoid_personality_disorder

"It is disputed whether SPD should be considered a "disorder" at all, since it does not necessarily involve any suffering either for the affected individual or for others. Many people are critical of society's tendency to pathologise certain personality styles simply because they are unconventional. In their opinion, such a tendency is incompatible with the idea that an individual may choose any lifestyle that he or she desires, as long as it does not disrupt the social order. Others think that, in some cases, strong SPD symptoms may result in an affected person living a dull and unfulfilling life. They think that this is a sufficient argument for maintaining SPD as a personality disorder."

[Neppy]

I chose "possibly", because I have some schizoid characteristics. However, I don't think I'm a schizoid. I prefer my own company, but I do have friends, and furthermore, I enjoy spending time with them. Just not excessive amounts of time. Some of these friends are extremely close to me and I can tell them pretty much anything, and I value that highly. However, I don't need many friends and I don't need to be around the ones I have.

The lack of a sex drive, or being asexual, hits pretty close to home. I don't think I've ever walked past someone in the street and thought "woah, I'd do him". I don't get horny looking at other people.. as in, I'm not sexually aware, but I'm no stranger to self-gratification/masturbation (forgive me for being crude). So obviously I've got some liking for sexual pleasure. However, I consider myself unhealthily frigid and for this reason I've had no sexual relations with another person. Not even kissing or fondling.

I take pleasure in solitary activities. But I have difficulty playing with other people. Does Diablo II count? Haha. I am detached and objective, but I'm not completely ignorant to other peoples' feelings or plights. I'll notice them - but they rarely engage my sympathies.

I don't suffer from anxiety. I'm not a dejected, depressed or (for lack of a better word) pitiful being. I'm actually very confident. I walk with my head held up and I'm capable of social interaction. I'm not prone to anger and I rarely quarrel with people. And I'm not pessimistic by default either. I prefer to call it realism.

I wouldn't call this a disorder, really. Just a way of being.

[the_stumpycat]

Many people are critical of society's tendency to pathologise certain personality styles simply because they are unconventional.

I recall having a similar debate about depression - because I am suicidal a lot of the time, feel despair, have low self worth, don't get enjoyment out of things etc etc doesn't to me mean that there is necessarily anything medically wrong.

There is huge potential (which I would support) for me actually being a fairly irrelevant person in the global scheme of things, and leading a fairly shit and unenjoyable life - the fact that I am aware of this and therefore show traits which they describe as clinical depression merely reflects the fact that I am more self-aware and observant than most.

[Prozac]

You probably wouldn't start a thread inquiring about other people's opinions on this topic if you were abnormally withdrawn. Also, people with mental problems tend to not be able to look at it objectively on their own.

this is interesting.. i don't think anybody with any/some or no problems can look at "it" objectively ... mainly because we are self-skewed to begin with and can see nothing beyond what we believe to be objectively subjective

therefore..somewhat.. psychology generally is not a science - its really more a psuedo science masquarading as a serious form of introspective truths according to another's analysis of behavior..which is skewed by their own issues, and that is defined/analyzed by others who have their own skewed version of human truths..circular with a twist

[naruto littles helpers.jpeg]

However, I consider myself unhealthily frigid and for this reason I've had no sexual relations with another person. Not even kissing or fondling.

care for any help with that, mam?

[toppyoushimonai]

I could explain how messed up I am but afterwards you'd all have to take medication.

[Iblis]

Nah, not totally schizoid. Sometimes I fit that description, others I'm just the opposite of it. The fact that I'm a moody person probably is the thing messing with my tests: sometimes INTP, others ENTJ. I think bipolar would apply more. Better: just neurotic.<_<

[Mountain_Recluse]

I recall having a similar debate about depression - because I am suicidal a lot of the time, feel despair, have low self worth, don't get enjoyment out of things etc etc doesn't to me mean that there is necessarily anything medically wrong.

There is huge potential (which I would support) for me actually being a fairly irrelevant person in the global scheme of things, and leading a fairly shit and unenjoyable life - the fact that I am aware of this and therefore show traits which they describe as clinical depression merely reflects the fact that I am more self-aware and observant than most.
The above hits home. Everything you say is true of me too. My only hope is to write at least one book to leave behind something of all that I've learned.

I believe we are more pessimistic, cynical, jaded, etc. because we do see reality more clearly. I know that as I do more research into this world, past and present and the reasonably foreseeable future -- prospects look bad and they may be terrible. Even on good days I'm not very optimistic.

We know too much.
Ignorance really is bliss.

[pangolin]

http://www.geocities.com/ptypes/schizoidpd.html
I'm not attempting to diagnose myself, but this describes me very accurately.

Here's another: http://www.toad.net/~arcturus/dd/schizoid.htm

What do you think?

Hmm. Highly subjective normative assessment containing an awful lot of general INTP characteristics, but contrariwise several mutually conflicting characteristics. Sounds like they want to say antisocial people are crazy.

Reminds me of the same kind of issue with Aspergers.

Normative psychology is, to some degree, dumb.

<_<

[Kristiana]

We INTPs are not warm and fuzzy and thrilled by lots of social interaction, but not necessarily to the degree of disfunction. All humans exhibit behaviors on a spectrum. The behavior doesn't become a mental disorder unless it completely interferes with life. Do you have a job? Go to school? Have a friend? Express annoyance or anger? Diagnose yourself? I have spent too many years feeling disfunctional and anti-social and I'm thrilled to find a website where everybody's feeling and behaviors fall into the same general area of the big spectrum of human behaviors. I can definitely relate to the schizoid laundry list...but I don't experience them to the degree that I can't function. I would rather have schizoid tendencies than a borderline personality disorder...that is probably an S problem :)

I know quite a few girls with borderline, actually. Their types: ISFP, ESFP, ENTJ, ESFP, INFJ.

From the research, it seems borderline is strongly connected to childhood sexual abuse, although not all who were abused become borderline, and not all borderlines were abused. Chronic invalidation, combined with a genetic predisposition, has also been linked to borderline. So it's probably not related to S vs N, just that the SFP types might make it a bit more obvious. :)

I am INTJ and have a few borderline traits, but not the disorder.

Yep, I know this thread was from awhile ago... but I'm bored ;)

[Ferrus]

I am sort of like that personality but I want sex and laughs with friends so badly.

[Stoic]

I think we are schizoids minus the high neuroticism.

[rainfall]

I get called schizoid all the time by me parents. But I'm indifferent to their ... Oh snap!

[mancroft]

http://www.geocities.com/ptypes/schizoidpd.html

set off my virus alarm

[Arcturus]

* neither desires nor enjoys close relationships, including being part of a family;

* almost always chooses solitary activities;

* has little, if any, interest in having sexual experiences with another person;

* takes pleasure in few, if any, activities;

* lacks close friends or confidants other than first-degree relatives;

* appears indifferent to the praise or criticism of others;

* shows emotional coldness, detachment, or flattened affectivity.


That's me to a 'T'.

Then again, probably all intps are kind of schizoid.

[abathur]

so do we look schizoid because we're INTP--or INTP because we're schizoid? Eh?

[Utopmk]

* neither desires nor enjoys close relationships, including being part of a family;

* almost always chooses solitary activities;

* has little, if any, interest in having sexual experiences with another person;

* takes pleasure in few, if any, activities;

* lacks close friends or confidants other than first-degree relatives;

* appears indifferent to the praise or criticism of others;

* shows emotional coldness, detachment, or flattened affectivity.










That's me to a 'T'.

Then again, probably all intps are kind of schizoid.

How many of these do you have to have?

[Arcturus]

How many of these do you have to have?

From the first link:

The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, Fourth Edition (American Psychiatric Association, 1994, pg. 641) describes Schizoid Personality Disorder as a pervasive pattern of detachment from social relationships and a restricted range of expression of emotions in interpersonal settings, beginning by early adulthood and present in a variety of contexts, as indicated by four (or more) of the following:

[abathur]

It's like a scavenger hunt.

[venerationOFrabbits]

opps I confused tangential thoughts with schizoid.

I'm not really a schizoid.