Learning to do smalltalk, improving interaction skills

[PsiKik]

I have been trying to improve my small talk abilities.
Yesterday I had 2 interactions with 2 people that went well.
I was asked the usual 'how are you?'. I was able to respond in kind
and generate some chatter about my new preference in breakfast cereal.
Normally such conversation is totally pointless and I would strugle to even think of such a topic, but the interaction left me feeling slightly upbeat.

Has anyone here had a simmilar experience as in
deliberately and conscientiously seeking to improve such communication skills? Has it worked?

[Oblivious]

Normally such conversation is totally pointless and I would strugle to even think of such a topic, but the interaction left me feeling slightly upbeat.


You mean it wasn't such a strugle this time? I also get an upbeat feeling on those rare occasions, but I still strugle...

[PsiKik]

Normally such conversation is totally pointless and I would strugle to even think of such a topic, but the interaction left me feeling slightly upbeat.


You mean it wasn't such a strugle this time? I also get an upbeat feeling on those rare occasions, but I still strugle...

It was not really a 'strugle', just that this time I was consciously trying to talk and make 'small talk'. In the past before I knew about INTPness I would just be frustrated at just another bad interaction and would be thinking 'these people probably see me as unfriendly or snobish'.

The other interaction I had was a bit more difficult in that the person
after doing the 'how are you' stuff started asking me questions about my apartment, what I was doing, whether i liked the company etc. This was harder because I was in my office and in the middle of something( I was trying to get back into the flow of a program I am writing).

In retrospect the person was obviously trying to have a conversation or even get to know me. I answered the questions but did not invite further conversation, partly because I don't see this person as being a potential friend, due to age/intelligence.

[Almaviva]

I've gotten better at small-talk over the last few years. I think more important than actually getting more ability is learning to shut off the "critical observer" part during and after you have conversations.

The reason to talk to people should be that you like talking to people. The trouble with beating ourselves up is that it is going to make us not want to make the effort again.

I find that the average person can talk circles around me, and also that what average people talk about isn't very interesting to me. But if I talk to enough people, I do get into some conversations that are interesting. And I can only take social situations in certain doses before I get tired, but that's okay too. But it's definitely worthwhile to not be completely isolated.

[t]

i've gotten better, but i still have some problems. i hate to say it, but having a drink or two is ultimately what eases me into the small talk mode.

i have to say that i have decent social skills considering i'm naturally introverted. i find the more i force myself to socialize, the easier it gets. i made a huge effort when i went to college to be sociable b/c i was sick of being the quiet & reserved one out of my friends. i felt that my friends got more attention from guys than i did because i wasn't outgoing enough. so when i went to college i forced myself to go out and talk to people. usually i'd follow the lead of a friend of mine, but instead of just tagging along like always, i'd try and contribute to an existing conversation. i still have problems initiating conversation myself.

one of the other things that helped me was just coming to terms with the fact that i don't have to be extroverted to have a good time. i just stopped expecting to connect with the people i meet when i'm out. i find that when i'm out and i meet a guy, i'm more apt to talk to him rather briefly and give him my number. that way i don't have to come up with small talk in a setting that's uncomfortable for me. instead i get the opportunity to talk to him on the phone and one on one, which is much more suited for my personality. plus i realized that it's ok if i stick to my group of friends and then let them meet people. small talk isn't as hard when there's already a conversation going. oh oh oh and i find just sitting at the bar w/ a friend and letting people come up to you is a lot easier than walking around the room amongst groups of people already in conversations.

oh, and i always give myself enough time to rest and be by myself after socializing. it takes so much out of me. i don't force myself to go out multiple nights in a row b/c i know it'll just make me more and more uncomfortable as i get more and more tired. if i've had a long week and i want the weekend to myself, i take it. i find the older i get, the more my friends understand this about me.

but now that i've written an essay, i think the best way to work on your social skills is to first accept how you are and what makes you comfortable and then work with that. if walking up to people and starting a conversation scares the crap out of you (like it does me), then sit at the bar and let people approach you... and so on & so forth.

[MacGuffin]

i hate to say it, but having a drink or two is ultimately what eases me into the small talk mode.

See my sig below.....

[t]

[quote="Oblivious"][quote=PsiKik]


In retrospect the person was obviously trying to have a conversation or even get to know me. I answered the questions but did not invite further conversation, partly because I don't see this person as being a potential friend, due to age/intelligence.

this was the hardest thing for me to get over when i started forcing myself to socialize and started making new friends at college. i felt like a lot of people weren't that intelligent and normally, i'd immediately become disinterested in them and go about my merry way. i remember the first thing i thought when i met some of my now best friends was "wow, they have awful taste in music". but as part of my experiment to be more sociable, i forced myself to at least try and pursue friendships with them. the more i got to know some of these people, the more i realized that there was some intelligence lurking under the exterior. i was in class with this guy who i never thought of as someone i could connect with, and surprisingly enough, he started analyzing literature with a vocabulary i'd never expect. same thing with this other guy i knew. i never thought of him as anyone with intellect, and then one day i looked at his movie collections and found amazing movies in there. we ended up discussing movies and have been best friends ever since. i learned that you can't always crucify someone for their initial shortcomings. i mean, think of how we come off sometimes? if my friends had dismissed me as just another quiet girl who didn't like people much, then i probably wouldn't have many friends right now.

[Boozer]

I think t makes a great point. Don't overestimate your ability to gauge other people's intelligence.

For my own part I really need to work on small talk. I just have trouble coming up with topics to talk about when I don't feel comfortable. Meeting complete strangers makes me nervous, so chatting with strangers is tough. Small talk with people I've spoken to at least a little is easy. I guess that why everyone talks about the weather and sports or whatever, they are supposedly common ground for most people. Now I just have to figure out what small talk topics girls are interested in.

[Avengardh]

I can do it, I learned how to at an early age (parents are ENTPs).

I get tired of it though...sometimes I just don't do it anymore, but when people talk to me, I kinda have to talk back...

[Laeskis]

I am completely contra-smalltalk and I refuse to practice it. I especially dislike the "how are you?" question....

[SheepDog]

I am completely contra-smalltalk and I refuse to practice it. I especially dislike the "how are you?" question....
I couldn't agree more. Smalltalk is a major waste of time. If I can relate to someone, then I'm pleasantly surprised, and talking doesn't require any extra effort. But I don't consider being able to talk about trivia, the weather, sports, etc. to be even remotely worthwhile. Whomever says I "should" practice it is, wrong, frankly. Take your "shoulds" somewhere else, I'm trying to think.

[crule81]

I especially dislike the "how are you?" question....

I tend to throw people off because I rarely answer the question "oh, great!" like many others. It's usually "Ok." since I am neither happy nor sad most of the time (just tired). Because I don't answer with enthusiasm, but with general honesty, people tend to think there's always something wrong or that I am depressed.

[Seraph]

I am completely contra-smalltalk and I refuse to practice it. I especially dislike the "how are you?" question....

Complete agreement. Why do we ask "How are you?" We don't give a damn really how the other person's doing! Or at least I don't.

I'm decent at smalltalk, only because I want to avoid looking like an anti-social freak. I really wish we could use conversation for what it's made for though: to gain information. I'd love to be able to walk up to someone and say, "Hey! Let's get into a massive philosophical debate!"

[SheepDog]

"Hey! Let's get into a massive philosophical debate!"
I might have to try that...

I had a college professor that used to answer the phone, "Fine, thanks. And you?" to stay a step ahead of the greeting ritual. Another good one is "Fine I hope." as in the written letters that start with "how have you been? find I hope."

[PsiKik]

I am completely contra-smalltalk and I refuse to practice it. I especially dislike the "how are you?" question....

Complete agreement. Why do we ask "How are you?" We don't give a damn really how the other person's doing! Or at least I don't.

I'm decent at smalltalk, only because I want to avoid looking like an anti-social freak. I really wish we could use conversation for what it's made for though: to gain information. I'd love to be able to walk up to someone and say, "Hey! Let's get into a massive philosophical debate!"

The 'how are you question' seems to be mostly some kind of social convention - it has nothing to do with really wanting to know how the other person is.

This reminds me of a film I saw where some Japanese business men were doing a course on American culture before coming over and the instructor is going over just this issue.
He asks the Japanese guy "How are ya!" all loud and positive
The Japanese Guy replies "My bowels are not well."
The instructor then explains that the American has no interrest in how he's really feeling.

[Misty_Kye]

I've always thought of "How are you" as a less formal way to say Hello then "How do you do". I was taught that the correct answer was "Fine and how are you?" which leads to "Fine, thank you". I've also noticed that if you substitute fine with Great, not bad, or something like that, it tends to lead to further conversation.

Looking at the greeting in that respect I actually prefer it. I think that by greeting people in a formal manner it sets the stage of conversation to more of a thinking realm. The response lets the speaker know if you want to engage in further conversation. At least that has been my experience.

I know that the reason people respond to me that way is in part due to my body language and facial expressions and not just what words I say. So I don't know how well this theory fits the populous that commonly use this form of greeting.

[spirilis]

Initiating smalltalk with people I don't know... I can't handle. I hate it.


Initiating smalltalk with people I DO know, on the other hand, is easy as hell. I usually spice it up by going off into weird tangents about weird stuff nobody cares about, but it adds "uniqueness" to my personality as people have told me.

[Strephonade]

I am completely contra-smalltalk and I refuse to practice it. I especially dislike the "how are you?" question....

I take it as a rhetorical question and just answer, "Fine, thanks. How are you?" They respond in kind, and having both said "hi", we can get on with whatever we were doing in the first place. If they insist, I usually try to work in some mention of how busy I am. Most people are fine with that.

[songbird36]

Interesting topic.

I think making small talk is a skill we all have to learn (not just INTPs). I'm not sure it comes naturally to many people. Small talk is normally the first layer of communication we have with any new person. The inability to make small talk can actually impede us in getting ahead in career, leisure organisations and that sort of thing, and can also prevent us ever getting to know people who could potentially be good friends, or even mates. Good small talk can make the person we're talking to feel comfortable quickly, whereas a more intense, personal conversation might trespass beyond that person's comfort zone too quickly.

So I think it has a place (but I suspect I'm out on a limb here)!

[Vagabond]

I can do smalltalk (being around extroverts and sensors a lot does that to you). Still, I find it pointless, not to mention draining; I do it whenever it is needed, like when interviewed by a talkative potential new boss, still most of the times I am just pretending to listen to them and drop an occasional "I see" reply. I might do some talking myself though, if it is too hard to avoid it. However, it always leaves me drained, so like I said, I avoid it unless necessary. I don't see the point in talking just to excercise my vocal chords.

[Melody]

i not good at it

just my mind cannot generate anything not specifically queried

[Niflheimian]

Heh, sometimes I ignore whoever's trying to initiate the conversation, which usually fails, sadly. After my "first defense" has been penetrated, I say "what?" to stall and gather my ideas (sometimes this requires asking he/she to repeat more than once). Then I can only hope a "yes" or "no" question was asked.
If not, hopefully it will require a short response, followed by several "mm hmm"'s.

I use this policy mostly for strangers, though nearly everyone is a stranger to me.
Anyway, there's another one of my proven-effective social (butterfly) techniques.

[nobarcode]

Has anyone here had a simmilar experience as in
deliberately and conscientiously seeking to improve such communication skills? Has it worked?

I took an assertiveness training class once. It helped.........hone my arguement style. B)

I also forced myself to take a public speaking class in college. I learned that I can do it; and with practice, it's easy. So I guess you could say improving my communication worked.

But, the point is, I think; social interaction remains draining regardless of skill. I haven't found a solution for that yet.

[PsiKik]

Interesting topic.

I think making small talk is a skill we all have to learn (not just INTPs). I'm not sure it comes naturally to many people. Small talk is normally the first layer of communication we have with any new person. The inability to make small talk can actually impede us in getting ahead in career, leisure organisations and that sort of thing, and can also prevent us ever getting to know people who could potentially be good friends, or even mates. Good small talk can make the person we're talking to feel comfortable quickly, whereas a more intense, personal conversation might trespass beyond that person's comfort zone too quickly.

So I think it has a place (but I suspect I'm out on a limb here)!

I think there could be a further division of categories of smalltalk.
The frequency that you see the people and their relation to you.

eg. the quick how are you you say to people you see every freaking
day who are just co-workers, shop clercs etc. and wont have much interaction with.
The complete stranger at, say a party, conference or whatever.

A friend at work and I have a convention where we do a silly head
nod which we have agreed fulfills the function of the 'how are you'.

Actually, over the last few days when I have been observing and thinking about the subject of small talk, and the 'how are you' greeting in particular, I think that most people are not especially 'experts' at it. It is actually an easily learned skill/activity.
The tone of voice, body language varies on your relationship with the person.
Eg, I have been watching the way two particular people( of opposite sex )
greet each other, they may be flirting, but I dont know. That is a whole subject on it own .

[t]

But, the point is, I think; social interaction remains draining regardless of skill. I haven't found a solution for that yet.

i don't think there is a solution for it. i think it's just the way we are. the only "solution" i've found is recognizing that i'm going to be drained and giving myself a few days to recooperate.

[songbird36]

Why do we find it "draining"?

Is it because we're inherently more interested in ourselves than in finding out about others?

[Tranzors]

I think most of us CAN DO SMALL talk, but we just get bored doing it. If you put your mind to it, anyone can do small talk, it's just 99x harder if it's really boring.

[candela]

I don't think I've ever done small talk. I don't get it. I'm thinking I'm going to stop shaking hands with people too.

[coffeezombie]

Why would I want to engage in small talk? I'd rather make people talk seriously and intellectually to me and not conform to the kind of conversation that they want.

[Almaviva]

i not good at it

just my mind cannot generate anything not specifically queried

That's an interesting observation. I've felt like that too. I used to have to stay after class because I'd sit at my desk and I couldn't think of anything to write about for an open-ended creative writing assignment.

What I think it might be, at least for me, isn't that I can't come up with things without being queried, but when I do come up with non-specific things, I'm just so tangential and out-there that it's not really socially acceptable. For example, if someone's "random thoughts" are about recent current events, or weather, or something they say on TV, and they bring it up, that's a conversation. If what my mind wanders towards is some weird concept of math or computer programming I can barely articulate if I tried, then that's not so good for conversation.

I think I may have learned to repress my "talk about whatever" mode from a pretty early age.

[Nighthawk]

But, the point is, I think; social interaction remains draining regardless of skill. I haven't found a solution for that yet.

i don't think there is a solution for it. i think it's just the way we are. the only "solution" i've found is recognizing that i'm going to be drained and giving myself a few days to recooperate.

Did you know that it is equally draining for extraverts NOT to move around and talk with others on a regular basis? Watch them sometime in a work environment, or quiet place. They will get up about every 10-15 minutes to strike up a conversation with somebody. Make them sit and concentrate for a few hours and they will go nuts. I had an ENTP friend at work with whom I could almost set my clock by the frequency with which I'd hear him get out of his chair to go talk with somebody.

Ironically, each type believes that everybody else thinks just like them ... unless they've made some effort to study personalities. Extraverts think everybody likes "energizing" interruptions to chat, so introverts see them as annoying. Introverts think everybody hates the intrusion on their concentration, so extraverts see us as aloof. Unfortunately, there is a strong pro-extravert bias in our society, so much of society sees us as being "wrong."

[atypical]

I'm allright at smalltalk, but I haven't used it since I threw out my macintosh.
anyway...

Yeah, i find smalltalk tedious. Back in high school I never really anchored myself in any particular social group, instead bounching from table to table, all the while wondering why I didn't "fit in" anywhere. I'd sit with a group for a while, but then I'd become bored out of my brain and would go looking for something better. Only in one-on-one interactions did I ever feel satisfied, usually because the conversation would eventually progress to something (slightly) more interesting.

I think trying to learn to smalltalk a pointless exercise - you'll feel as if you're lying to yourself the whole time, and you won't get anything out of it anyway. Be confident in who you are, don't be afraid to be silent, don't let yourself feel pressured to give in to silly social institutions invented by dimwits.

[adamaw11]

Yeah, i find smalltalk tedious. Back in high school I never really anchored myself in any particular social group, instead bounching from table to table, all the while wondering why I didn't "fit in" anywhere. I'd sit with a group for a while, but then I'd become bored out of my brain and would go looking for something better. Only in one-on-one interactions did I ever feel satisfied, usually because the conversation would eventually progress to something (slightly) more interesting.


Which high school was that, Brisbanite?

[atypical]

Actually i went to high school in Warwick, at the state high there. Now at UQ.

[Werdna]

That's an interesting observation. I've felt like that too. I used to have to stay after class because I'd sit at my desk and I couldn't think of anything to write about for an open-ended creative writing assignment.

I'm like that too. Didn't know it was an INTP thing...
I hated writing essays for that reason, I can't come up with a subject. I have to write about something I'm interested in. That's the only way I can be creative. Otherwise, I just sit there for hours staring at the paper.

If someone tries to engage me in smalltalk, I usually respond with single words or something humorous meaning to point out how stupid, dull and pointless I find that exercise to be. If it's a person I actually want to get to know, I try to steer the conversation into something interesting instead. I think smalltalking is something you need to learn only if you want to have a lot of acquaintances. I've always preferred to have one or two real friends.

[Almaviva]

Werdna: I've fininshed Wizardry I, so I know where your name comes from.

I know what you mean about essays. I arranged my university studies so that I'd never have to write an essay. Actually, I have learned to just write about anything that comes to mind now, but it's a skill I only got recently, in the last couple years. Talking aimlessly to people I can't do.

I've always had just one or maybe two very close friends as well, and when I'm in a relationship it has this nasty tendency to meet all my social needs so I gradually and unintentionally start shutting people out of my life.

[Anacaona]

But, the point is, I think; social interaction remains draining regardless of skill. I haven't found a solution for that yet.

i don't think there is a solution for it. i think it's just the way we are. the only "solution" i've found is recognizing that i'm going to be drained and giving myself a few days to recooperate.

I couldn't agree more... There is no way for us fo not finding it draining, it's part of our introversion...
I've tried to read books about conversation (small talk) it probably helped... But I still think my conversations are boring, I don't know what to talk about (when it comes to small talk)...

[afton]

I really wish we could use conversation for what it's made for though: to gain information. I'd love to be able to walk up to someone and say, "Hey! Let's get into a massive philosophical debate!"

Have you heard of Socrates Cafe?
http://www.philosopher.org/soccaf.html