Independence in the Soviet Bloc?

[mancroft]

You're from one of the former Soviet-bloc countries, I guess.

We will just have to assume that you are a prostitute from Kazakhstan.

[Shimpei]

We will just have to assume that you are a prostitute from Kazakhstan.

Thanks, it was very funny and insightful.

I didn't say "from the former Soviet Union" but from the "former Soviet bloc countries", i.e. Poland, Czech Republic, Slovakia, Hungary, Romania, Yugoslavia, Slovenia, etc.
Perhaps you should switch from prostitutes to studying politics/history of Europe.

[mancroft]

Thanks, it was very funny and insightful.

I didn't say "from the former Soviet Union" but from the "former Soviet bloc countries", i.e. Poland, Czech Republic, Slovakia, Hungary, Romania, Yugoslavia, Slovenia, etc.
Perhaps you should switch from prostitutes to studying politics/history of Europe.

Wrong.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_bloc

The term "Soviet bloc" INCLUDES the former Soviet Union.

[Shimpei]

Wrong.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_bloc

The term "Soviet bloc" INCLUDES the fromer Soviet Union.

Kasakhstan and the rest of the members of the former Soviet Union weren't independent countries with own goverments, parliaments and ministries.

[mancroft]

Kasakhstan and the rest of the members of the former Soviet Union weren't independent countries with own goverments, parliaments and ministries.

Come off it. Name ONE country in the old Soviet bloc that was independent. Look what happened to Czechoslovakia in the late 60s with Prague Spring.

ALL the Eastern bloc governments were Soviet puppets.

[Shimpei]

Come off it. Name ONE country in the old Soviet bloc that was independent. Look what happened to Czechoslovakia in the late 60s with Prague Spring.

ALL the Eastern bloc governments were Soviet puppets.

I knew you'd pick the word "independent". Again I say, at least the European socialist countries did have their own governments, ministries, and parliaments. Also their economies weren't so centralized as those in the Soviet Union. (And Russian was never an official language in these countries.)
The Soviet Union (together with its members) was one (legal, political, economic) entity. Hungary, Slovakia etc. were independent entities.

[mancroft]

I knew you'd pick the word "independent". Again I say, at least the European socialist countries did have their own governments, ministries, and parliaments. Also their economies weren't so centralized as those in the Soviet Union. (And Russian was never an official language in these countries.)
The Soviet Union (together with its members) was one (legal, political, economic) entity. Hungary, Slovakia etc. were independent entities.

Are you a Stalinist?

[Shimpei]

Are you a Stalinist?

No (far it be from me), but I've been living in Hungary since 1971 so perhaps I'm a bit more familiar with things that were/are going on here.

[mancroft]

No (far it be from me), but I've been living in Hungary since 1971 so perhaps I'm a bit more familiar with things that were/are going on here.

I thought you were a Stalinist because of your capacity for self-delusion and distortion of history.

EDIT you obviously weren't around when the 1956 Hungarian Revolution was going on:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1956_Hungarian_Revolution

[Dr. Haight]

Meanwhile, this innocent introduction thread has become a tense debate on post-Soviet European politics. I guess that's INTPc for ya...
I will move the Soviet Bloc debate to the appropriate area (so folks can find it) after my lunch.

[mancroft]

I will move the Soviet Bloc debate to the appropriate area (so folks can find it) after my lunch.

Bon appetit.

[Shimpei]

I thought you were a Stalinist because of your capacity for self-delusion and distortion of history.

Now that's really bitchy of you to say that.
There was no self-delusion let alone distortion of history involved in it. (Did I say these countries were really free?)

Edit: 1956 - yeah, my father was involved in it as a revolutionist. Again: I never said the former Soviet bloc countries had been free.

[mancroft]

Now that's really bitchy of you to say that.
There was no self-delusion let alone distortion of history involved in it. (Did I say these countries were really free?)


Obviously the words "free" and "independent" do not translate well into Hungarian.

In English the word "free" is almost but not exactly synonymous with "independent".

"Free" and ""Independent" includes the concept of NOT having another country's tanks rolling down your street.

[Shimpei]

Obviously the words "free" and "independent" do not translate well into Hungarian.

In English the word "free" is almost but not exactly synonymous with "independent".

"Free" and ""Independent" includes the concept of NOT having another country's tanks rolling down your street.

Ok, I wanted to say these countries were separate entities, unlike the Soviet Union's member "republics".

[mancroft]

Ok, I wanted to say these countries were separate entities, unlike the Soviet Union's member "republics".

OK have your it own way then.

[Dr. Haight]

The posts above have been moved here from the following location:

http://forums.intpcentral.com/showthread.php?p=385414&posted=1#post385414

[wildcat]

The posts above have been moved here from the following location:

http://forums.intpcentral.com/showthread.php?p=385414&posted=1#post385414
Shimpei is perfectly right.

Throughout the history of the occupation, the Russian Stalinists had a hard time in Central Europe. The first bloody purges took place in 1948.
That was the year Orwell wrote his famous book.

Europeans never succumbed under Soviet power. They were not just puppets. If it had been so, there would have been no need for all those bloody purges during the decades.
Under a long occupation one cannot talk about Communists and non Communists. Everybody was a "Communist." It has nothing to do with anything in the real world.

[Tlalocone]

I thought you were a Stalinist because of your capacity for self-delusion and distortion of history.

EDIT you obviously weren't around when the 1956 Hungarian Revolution was going on:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1956_Hungarian_Revolution

Finally somebody have told her the truth she(Shimpei) has to face.
Thanx mancroft. Finally a Non-hungarian had understood the things about hungary and soviet bloc thingies.
I Owe U 1 mancroft for your insight.

[wildcat]

I knew you'd pick the word "independent". Again I say, at least the European socialist countries did have their own governments, ministries, and parliaments. Also their economies weren't so centralized as those in the Soviet Union. (And Russian was never an official language in these countries.)
The Soviet Union (together with its members) was one (legal, political, economic) entity. Hungary, Slovakia etc. were independent entities.
The standpoint of Norwich has no consequence.
Budapest is not in Norwich.

[Shimpei]

:joft: