Weep for our children

[NoahFence]

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5738235

A New Zealand firm is betting on a U.S. market for a shopping cart that lets young children watch videos while their parents shop. Shaped like a car, the Cabco cart rents for $1, part of which goes to retailers like Wal-Mart and Publix, who are testing their popularity.

:huh:

[mancroft]

Yep, makes you wanna vomit.

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[attila_the_hunny]

I'd probably like it if I were a kid.

[camille]

Whatever happened to just screaming at your kids in the market to keep them occupied?

Just kidding. I'll bet supernanny is going to love that one.

[Ka.avik]

I'd probably like it if I were a kid.
yes, but would it develop your young mind, or turn it to mush?

TV denies most of the opportunities to use the imagination, not to mention that -- a shopping cart? You're supposed to be teaching kids how to shop -- things like, having good manners, and understanding the cost of living. Not arguing over who has the better seat/view to watch barney extol the virtues of corporate consumerism on the walmart channel.

[floid]

Shaping raw, unruly human beings into dependably autonomic consumers takes a lot of time and effort.

One can never start the training too early.

[attila_the_hunny]

yes, but would it develop your young mind, or turn it to mush?

TV denies most of the opportunities to use the imagination, not to mention that -- a shopping cart? You're supposed to be teaching kids how to shop -- things like, having good manners, and understanding the cost of living.

Do you really think a three year-old is going to give a shit about all that? Kids have the attention span of what, 10 minutes? Which is exactly how long it will take me to ask what kind of snacks they want and which kind of cereal they favor. By the time it's probably going to make an impact on the child, they won't be able to fit in a shopping cart anymore, and have to deal with the reality of all that.

[Ivy]

yes, but would it develop your young mind, or turn it to mush?

TV denies most of the opportunities to use the imagination, not to mention that -- a shopping cart? You're supposed to be teaching kids how to shop -- things like, having good manners, and understanding the cost of living. Not arguing over who has the better seat/view to watch barney extol the virtues of corporate consumerism on the walmart channel.

Have YOU ever taken children shopping?

I'm all for it!

[LongSilence]

I understand its benefits but in the end its just another way for parents to feel at ease encouraging their children to not participate in an activity and another lost opportunity for the two of them to do it together. The fact they go to watch TV just makes it lose any potential value too- some sort of play pen might encourage exercise and social interaction. The kids are going to have to be supervised anyway. After all, no-one could justify leaving their kid unsupervised in such a place even if they are watching TV.

But I guess its cheap and it has little potential for legal liability...

[Ivy]

I understand its benefits but in the end its just another way for parents to feel at ease encouraging their children to not participate in an activity and another lost opportunity for the two of them to do it together. The fact they go to watch TV just makes it lose any potential value too- some sort of play pen might encourage exercise and social interaction. The kids are going to have to be supervised anyway. After all, no-one could justify leaving their kid unsupervised in such a place even if they are watching TV.

But I guess its cheap and it has little potential for legal liability...

I take my 1 year old shopping every once in awhile, and every time I remember why I usually go alone after the kids are in bed. My 6 year old is a old enough to be helpful and shopping can be a learning experience for her, but the baby is just.. wild. There's no "doing it together" for this one. He wants to climb out of the cart and run down the aisles tearing shit up.

I don't mean it to sound like I don't enjoy my son. Of course I love him and at home or at the park his antics are very cute. At the store, though, when he needs to sit still and I can't be his playmate the entire time. He's fairly distractible at first, but the most boring part (waiting in line and paying) comes at the end, when he's been sitting in the cart and is nearing the end of his rope.

Yeah, I'd probably use the TV cart.

[libertarianjim]

I'd prefer that kids never be taken into public.

[Monica]

I don't think TV develops the mind in any way, especially at such a young age. If and when I have kids they won't be watching TV until they are at least older than 4-5 and I don't even know about bringing them into such a commercial environment as a shopping center. I don't have cable myself. I regret all the crap I watched as a kid. Laverne and Shirley every night while mom cooked dinner!

[Ivy]

Still noting that none of the dissenters actually have kids...

[omnirook]

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5738235

A New Zealand firm is betting on a U.S. market for a shopping cart that lets young children watch videos while their parents shop. Shaped like a car, the Cabco cart rents for $1, part of which goes to retailers like Wal-Mart and Publix, who are testing their popularity.

:huh:
Why didn't I see that coming? Hell, now there are screens at the registers that alternate ads w/quick cooking lessons. God forbid you talk to your brat and teach him or her a few things about smart shopping, starting with - never go food shopping when you're hungry ... My neice thinks that her father is a monster because he takes the tv away as a punishment - that and restricts watching: homework first, chores next, tv last.

I remember getting into a rage years back when they started showing regular commercials in the movie theatres along w/the trailers. Who knew that that was "tip of the ad berg?"

[Ivy]

Why didn't I see that coming? Hell, now there are screens at the registers that alternate ads w/quick cooking lessons. God forbid you talk to your brat and teach him or her a few things about smart shopping, starting with - never go food shopping when you're hungry ... My neice thinks that her father is a monster because he takes the tv away as a punishment - that and restricts watching: homework first, chores next, tv last.

I remember getting into a rage years back when they started showing regular commercials in the movie theatres along w/the trailers. Who knew that that was "tip of the ad berg?"

Another childless dissenter. :)

What can I teach a 1-year-old who likes to put buckets on his head about smart shopping?

[Monica]

Another childless dissenter. :)

What can I teach a 1-year-old who likes to put buckets on his head about smart shopping?

I don't understand your point. You think TV is good for kids, or what?

[Ivy]

I don't understand your point. You think TV is good for kids, or what?

Is it either good or bad? That seems unnecessarily polarized, especially for INTPs. Too much TV sucks, but I don't think a little TV is harmful for kids. And, particularly for children small enough to ride in the cart, I don't think the grocery store is this wonderful learning environment and bonding experience that a little screen in the cart is going to rob the children of.

[Eli]

My kids are 3 & 5 and I wouldn't use a cart with a TV. Yeah, it might make the shopping trip easier for me but I think it sends the wrong message. Watch this TV and leave me alone. I'd rather have them aware and involved what is going on around them.

[Ivy]

My kids are 3 & 5 and I wouldn't use a cart with a TV. Yeah, it might make the shopping trip easier for me but I think it sends the wrong message. Watch this TV and leave me alone. I'd rather have them aware and involved what is going on around them.

I'm so glad you posted. :) I was starting to feel like the Lone Person With An Actual Stake in This Thread.

You raise a good point. And, yes, I would also rather have them aware and involved in what is going on around them. At 3, I hope my now-1-year-old is able to do that. But right now, "involved in what is going on" isn't very pleasant. The last time I took him shopping (the day before yesterday, which is probably why this is fresh on my mind), he kept trying to stand up and jump out of the cart, tried to eat the bananas and bit open the bread bag, and when I tried holding him instead he kept asking to nurse in the middle of the store as I walked down the aisle.

The whole trip was shitty, for both of us. The TV thing wouldn't just have made it easier on me, it might have made it more pleasant for him, too. Is it really different, in principle, than those car-shaped carts? I'll admit that I thank the plastic gods for those, too-- he'll sit and turn the wheel in one of those for a lot longer than he'll sit in a plain cart.

Frankly, what I plan on doing is just continuing to do my shopping at night after the kids are asleep. Even if the TV carts come here, I'm not even sure that it would keep his attention for a whole shopping trip.

[attila_the_hunny]

Another childless dissenter. :)

What can I teach a 1-year-old who likes to put buckets on his head about smart shopping?

I don't have kids, and I'm for it.

Maybe they'll have PBS or Sesame Street available for the kids to watch?

[Eli]

Yeah, there is a world of difference between taking a 1 year old and a 3 year old along on a shopping trip. I've had those nightmare trips too. When my kids were younger I would avoid taking them as much as possible. They do have thier limitations at that age no matter how good a parent you are or how well behaved your kid is once they hit that limit there is not a whole lot you can do.

Good point on the "car carts" purpose of being a distraction. My kids love them too. It is the tv thing that gets me, it is so easy to flip it on and get them to tune out. I don't mind the car so much as a distraction because when they are in the car they tend to play games with each other and use their imaginations.

Truthfully, the association with Wal-Mart isn't helping me see the concept in a positive light either. I tend to want to weep for my children's future just by walking into that place.

[cryingmime]

they already have these at the meijer by me (in Rolling Meadows, for you chicagoans that really want to see them). they show Arthur episodes. Arthur is educational programming. Why is it wrong for children to learn something while their parents are getting something done?

I'm sorry that you had such a negative experience with television, or that your parents did not love you (maybe both!?)Perhaps you should take those issues up with your parents, or mention them to your therapist.

As for the shopping cart that kills two birds with one stone (educating kids and letting parents get necessary errands done..for those of you not keeping up), i'm all for it.

r

[25fd]

TV, at least what is mostly watched and popular, turns people into drones. Programming is of low quality, manipulative, fake, and filled with stupid commercials. I haven't watched TV in three years. It took a little will power to do it, but the extra free time I enjoy made it worth.

[cryingmime]

TV, at least what is mostly watched and popular, turns people into drones. Programming is of low quality, manipulative, fake, and filled with stupid commercials. I haven't watched TV in three years. It took a little will power to do it, but the extra free time I enjoy made it worth.


By giving up TV completely, TV is still controlling your life. True Discipline (or will power, call it what you will) involves figuring out how to live with Television watching in moderation.

In actuality, not watching TV is easier than watching just some TV.


r

[PiccoloNamek]

If I ever have any children, they certainly will not be watching any television, especially not in the shopping cart. Televison is a completel brain drain, and in fact, can actually warp the way a child's brain develops.

[Ivy]

If I ever have any children, they certainly will not be watching any television, especially not in the shopping cart. Televison is a completel brain drain, and in fact, can actually warp the way a child's brain develops.

Got a cite for that?

I really don't think it's necessary for anybody, kids included, to be doing intellectual and engaging activities every waking minute of the day. I can assure you that my kids get plenty of play and mental stimulation, AND they're able to fit in a little telly here and there. I don't think it's all-or-nothing.

[Rajah]

Tonight, I had to go to Target with my 20-month-old son. I would have paid $50 for one of those freakin' carts.

[25fd]

By giving up TV completely, TV is still controlling your life. True Discipline (or will power, call it what you will) involves figuring out how to live with Television watching in moderation.

In actuality, not watching TV is easier than watching just some TV.


r
How is TV controlling me? I don't watch it because I think it's of low quality, manipulative, fake, and filled with stupid commercials. How else should I put it? It's not challenging me. I can waste my time with other things that are challenging.

I did the same thing as most people do come from work, school, whatever, eat and then turn the TV on. It's irrelevant for how long it was on. In order to break a habit one needs some will power. It takes will power to find something to do for your kids. However it's so easy and cheap to put them in front of the TV!
It true, for some people there's no escape. They've got themselves so deep into the rat race they have to work all day and see their kids very briefly every day. For those people the TV looks like the perfect refuge. I am not saying this is your situation. I just saw it over and over again in my brother, and relatives. TV is like smoking to them. I rather see them not smoke at all then smoke in moderation!

Television is North America's cheapest entertainment source. Whatever educational elements can be found in Television it doesn't change anything. It's mainly a brain washing instrument.

[PiccoloNamek]

Got a cite for that?

I really don't think it's necessary for anybody, kids included, to be doing intellectual and engaging activities every waking minute of the day. I can assure you that my kids get plenty of play and mental stimulation, AND they're able to fit in a little telly here and there. I don't think it's all-or-nothing.

No, I don't. It was in an article I read a while ago. What it said basically was that the constantly changing imagery and sound from the TV causes their brain to wire itself in such a way that that level of stimulation is always needed, and when it is taken away, there is a deficit of stimulation in the brain which can lead to behavioral problems.

I really wish I could find it.

[Ivy]

I did the same thing as most people do come from work, school, whatever, eat and then turn the TV on. It's irrelevant for how long it was on. In order to break a habit one needs some will power. It takes will power to find something to do for your kids. However it's so easy and cheap to put them in front of the TV!

It would be easier, frankly, to cut it out entirely than to let them watch it in moderation. My daughter likes TV. I am fine with letting her watch a little bit, but I agree that for the most part her mind and body need to be engaged and challenged. We have an agreement that she is allowed to watch one half-hour show in the late afternoon, but she needs to use the daylight to play outside as much as possible and the rest of the evening for other activities. If we got rid of the TV entirely, I would no longer have to monitor what and how much she watches. It really doesn't take that much energy to come up with things for her to do-- she's a bright little sucker and she comes up with plenty to do on her own.

[Ivy]

No, I don't. I was in an article I read a while ago. What it said basically was that the constantly changing imagery and sound from the TV causes their brain to wire itself in such a way that that level of stimulation is always needed, and when it is taken away, there is a deficit of stimulation in the brain which can lead to behavioral problems.

I really wish I could find it.

I'll see what I can dig up. I can imagine it might be true of excessive TV watching, or having it on as a background hum for a large part of the day.

[ohnoaninfp]

Man kids are getting too spoiled these days

[CEOofRawness]

When I have a kid I'll give you an opinion on that.

By then we should have hovering shopping carts and plasma 3D holographic television on em too.

Honestly I don't think anyone that doesn't have a kid can give too valid of an answer. Not saying we should blow em off completely, but they don't have sufficient experience with that kind of situation I believe to have a stong argument. It's easy for me to say it's wrong to have that, but if I had a kid I'd probably look at it from another angle.

[cryingmime]

It would be easier, frankly, to cut it out entirely than to let them watch it in moderation. My daughter likes TV. I am fine with letting her watch a little bit, but I agree that for the most part her mind and body need to be engaged and challenged. We have an agreement that she is allowed to watch one half-hour show in the late afternoon, but she needs to use the daylight to play outside as much as possible and the rest of the evening for other activities. If we got rid of the TV entirely, I would no longer have to monitor what and how much she watches. It really doesn't take that much energy to come up with things for her to do-- she's a bright little sucker and she comes up with plenty to do on her own.

At last! Someone that has kids and understands that television can be used in moderation. so many people take an "all or nothing" stance with their kids, which only ends up backfiring or turning their children into disconnected beings with no concept of a world outside of their own.

r

[Ivy]

At last! Someone that has kids and understands that television can be used in moderation. so many people take an "all or nothing" stance with their kids, which only ends up backfiring or turning their children into disconnected beings with no concept of a world outside of their own.

r

"Everything in moderation" is kind of my parenting motto. You want dessert? Sure, a little bit is fine, but as Cookie Monster says, "a cookie is a sometimes food." You want to watch TV? Okay, a half hour, but if you watch too much TV you'll be stupider than Jupiter. Sure, once in awhile she vegges out for longer than that, just like sometimes we have a big decadent dessert. Vegging and pigging out are okay in moderation, too. :)

I can see how the shopping cart TV might seem like going beyond "moderation," but IMO if you look at it rationally, it really isn't, necessarily. When TV use starts adding up to hours upon hours a day, it CAN be problematic, mostly because it takes the place of other, more worthwhile activities. Most people shop for, what, thirty minutes to an hour a week? So it's really not a huge exposure unless it's in the context of a TV in the kids' bedroom, a TV in the car, etc. Which, yeah, we know people whose kids are nearly always plugged in like that, and it ain't pretty.

[macr0]

By giving up TV completely, TV is still controlling your life. True Discipline (or will power, call it what you will) involves figuring out how to live with Television watching in moderation.

In actuality, not watching TV is easier than watching just some TV.
r

Like heroin right?

[macr0]

I feel like I'm taking crazy pills.

Has no one heard that the first 3-4 years of someone's life are the most important for shaping the rest of their entire life? Guess no one around here believes that.

TV, especially for small children, is designed specifically to overwhelm their stimuli. Did no one as a child (or at least seen a child) completely on a different planet when they are watching TV?

The colors, the sounds, the voices. All of these things are made to control children. Is that not obvious?

Why in the hell is this a good thing?

Moderation. Yeah. It's funny hearing them cry when they're not allowed to watch the purple teletubby. Crack from a crack addict.

At the same time, not all kids are the same and some don't get "hooked", so who cares anyway?

[Ivy]

I feel like I'm taking crazy pills.

I feel like you're taking crazy pills too.

;) Just kidding. But you can come down off your "the first three years are the most important blah blah blah" high horse now. I'm well aware of it, as I've educated small imps for many years. I do all kinds of edifying things with my children to help them form their little psyches. What you don't seem to understand is that there are many hours in a day, and all of the wonderful edifying wholesome activities parents can do and provide for their kids are not crowded out with a small amount of TV. Get a grip-- it's just not that big a deal to watch a little boob tube.

[sbw]

TV, at least what is mostly watched and popular, turns people into drones. Programming is of low quality, manipulative, fake, and filled with stupid commercials. I haven't watched TV in three years. It took a little will power to do it, but the extra free time I enjoy made it worth.


If I ever have any children, they certainly will not be watching any television, especially not in the shopping cart. Televison is a completel brain drain, and in fact, can actually warp the way a child's brain develops.

http://www.theonion.com/content/node/28694

Scott

[PiccoloNamek]

But I do own a television. I only use it for playing video games, and even then the only game I really play is DDR.

[macr0]

Get a grip-- it's just not that big a deal to watch a little boob tube.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3956361694476971154

:)

[Ivy]

Nice use of Peter Gabriel's soundtrack to Passion to create tension, but irrelevant. :)