Utopia?

[Birdsnest]

I've never seen this before until today. I am posting it here and it is posted here for comments of any sort. Is Utopian Humanitarianism something you would indulge in? I have no opinion yet, have not studied it yet.

Read on it here:
http://users.erols.com/jonwill/
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[Utopmk]

<<<<Utopian Mike
I regaurd this as the highest form of humanity, and philosophy.

[giftedmadness@hotmail.com]

You have got to be kidding me. We live in the 21st century and people still believe in this stuff?

[Division56]

You have got to be kidding me. We live in the 21st century and people still believe in this stuff?

Aren't you the conservative Christian? :mellow:

[Vagabond]

This philosophy assumes that everyone is willing to make these changes and go by these standards. This day will never come. It is sort of based in a collective mind and will to make the world ideal theory; you can't disregard the fact though that there are always going to be some people that will want to take advantage of the "sheep", which will bring things back to the current status eventually.

[Claverhouse]

And might not even quiet introverts get a bit... bored ?



Claverhouse :ph34r:

[nobarcode]

Every human institution has a guiding mission statement or philosophy. :huh:....that is subject to change at any given moment? Yet there is no specific global plan for Humanity's future. Says who? "You" have not been paying attention. Without a plan, happenstance determines destination. Based on what? Instead of leaving its fate up to chance, Humanity should select its own destination. shaytana says, "Oh the irony!"

Since Utopia is the best Humanity can perceive, Utopia should be Humanity's guiding philosophy. Utopia has not yet been precisely defined which makes this a dubious statement This ultimate philosophy of striving for the best life possible for everyone, can be one global element of common sense and common purpose in an otherwise complex and fragmented world. It has yet to happen in the history of mankind, therefore unreasonable...or pretentious. Utopian philosophy can be the goal that unites the world for good and noble actions. :zzz:
This web site has a modern day trilogy on how Humanity can achieve Utopia. To read any of the three books below, just click on that book. To read a summary of this trilogy, just scroll down this page. Plus, there are links to interesting web sites below the summary. Based on the above, I'm not interested.

[paladinoflunaria]

Time is not a dimension

Holy Shit! I've been waiting for someone else to say this! Of course in context they got it wrong (they contradict themselves by saying it is a forward motion- hmmm, isn't that a dimension?)


The third dimension exists because from all of the infinite possibilities only it could exist. Fourth or higher dimensions cannot exist because a space cannot be overfilled, in the same way that two separate three-dimensional objects cannot occupy the same space at the same time. A zero dimension, or nothingness, cannot exist, because there must be something for there to be an existence, and subsequently, there must be a dimension.

They didn't read "Flatland." This section is bullshit.


Math of the big bang theory, 0 = everything, does not equate. But math of the Infinity Theory, everything = everything, does equate.


I'm reading a book on zero right now. Everytime someone has stood against zero, zero annhiliates the challenger. If Cantor was violent, he would smack the shit out of someone who took an approach this short-sighted. These people are not very good conceptualists and they are trying very hard to work with concepts. Not a good thing.

From a fourth-dimensional perspective, it is easy for multiple universes to exist. The "edge" of an individual universe doesn't serve as a boundary because it folds over into another universe. Perfectly reasonable.

Think about the laws of conservation of energy and mass. Isn't it reasonable that matter/energy from one universe can fold over into another universe. Perhaps the "big bang" is just a certain reaction caused by this folding.

All and all, these people are going with science. Science has a twinge of subjectivity, so it isn't absolute. The Uncertainty Principle is yet another smack in the face for that kind of thinking.

2 and 2 make 5, for all of you who have read 1984. That should scream at you if you've read it. If you haven't read 1984, do it.

Try this one- existence has no beginning or end. It is a line, not a line segment. Even better- it is a circle, not a line segment. Look at nature... cyclic? :o URRRR... DUH?


Except for their conflict with subjectivity, this sounds very much like Buddhism for retards. If you want something more logical, and for more intelligent people, read up on it.


Buddhism is the religion for radical atheists. - Can't remember who said that. Even if you are Jewish, Hindu, or Amish, you can't argue with its points.

[Utopmk]

2 and 2 make 5, for all of you who have read 1984. That should scream at you if you've read it. If you haven't read 1984, do it.

I've read it several times. That is more of a tale of an anti-utopia.
In an ideal utopia, the "government governs the least."

Even though I have my doubts that man will ever be ready to commit theirselves to a "heaven on earth" , I don't see a reason we should not strive towards it.It is better than the alternative!

[paladinoflunaria]

Agreed. Anyone read, "The Republic," "Brave New World," "Utopia," or "Lost Horizon?"

I've read 1984, Brave New World, and part of the Republic.

[Odyssey]

As a fellow sufferer with paladin:


The third dimension exists because from all of the infinite possibilities only it could exist. Fourth or higher dimensions cannot exist because a space cannot be overfilled, in the same way that two separate three-dimensional objects cannot occupy the same space at the same time. A zero dimension, or nothingness, cannot exist, because there must be something for there to be an existence, and subsequently, there must be a dimension. & etc. ad nauseum

AHHHH!! *is highly inclined to hit my forehead repeatedly on keyboard from a highly inclined angle* (Two particles of matter cannot occupy the same space at the same time, but what about at different times? <Sigh> To twist their words, the fourth dimension keeps the third dimension from being overfilled at any one time. B) )

~Odyssey


PS: Obviously this should be proofread by a scientist for content X_X That, however, would destroy the bulk of his ideological construct! lol

[Utopmk]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v315/yurduhzeez3/rainbow_family_2004.jpg

[paladinoflunaria]

Whoa!

On a side note, two 3D particles can occupy the same 3D space in 4-space.

[CosmicDust]

I don't believe utopias or anti-utopias are possible to maintain, at least on a large scale (i.e., larger than the size and endurance of any experimental commune or cult). If they were, we probably would have seen at least an anti-utopia by now, given how many 1984-ish things have already occurred in the world.

[Johnny]

I have to admit publicly that the picture of the pregnant woman's belly is very beautiful.

[Claverhouse]

I would prefer the blonde. More mysterious, less overt... & blonde.



Claverhouse :ph34r:

[antireconciler]

Thermodynamically, shouldn't humanity settle into a mature, peaceful state (or end) eventually? (This probably assumes a fairly isolated system. The Sol Star System good enough?)

[int]

I have to admit publicly that the picture of the pregnant woman's belly is very beautiful.

:) ... lol.


"1984" was a spark that ignited a fire in my brain that changed my life. "Utopia" was a little difficult for me to get through but set a systematic basis of which to follow.

Utopmk, do you have those Chaos Majick (sp?) links available?

I know Churhill is often (mis?)quoted as saying:

"If you're not a liberal when you're 25, you have no heart. If you're not a conservative by the time you're 35, you have no brain."

Either way, I got it from a Lagwagon album, which used the sample from the movie "Swimming with Sharks" (great Kevin Spacey flick). I've always found it fitting in this debate. :)

[Utopmk]

Utopmk, do you have those Chaos Majick (sp?) links available?



http://chaosmatrix.org/library/chaos.php

[CosmicDust]

Thermodynamically, shouldn't humanity settle into a mature, peaceful state (or end) eventually?
Extinction.

[Claverhouse]

I know Churhill is often (mis?)quoted as saying:

"If you're not a liberal when you're 25, you have no heart. If you're not a conservative by the time you're 35, you have no brain."


I'm not sure, but the disgusting old brute started off as a conservative, his father nearly having been a Tory leader, switched to the liberals in his 30s, changed back to conservative after WWI, became Tory leader, and confided in his old age that he was always a liberal at heart.

I can't stand western liberalism. Crazy mixed-up kids.


Claverhouse :ph34r:

[giftedmadness@hotmail.com]

You have got to be kidding me. We live in the 21st century and people still believe in this stuff?

Aren't you the conservative Christian? :mellow:

You have a gross misunderstanding of what it means to be a "conservative Christian".

[Dengarm]

So basicly it just boils down to . . . "wouldn't it be nice if everyone was nice."

Wow! It's so deep! Noone has ever siad this before!
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(sarcastic)


P.S. I think the term you guys were looking for was distopian, not un-utopian.