Resembling other types

[waxwing]

Do you ever feel like an ENFP? In certain settings or even just that other people might think you are? I was reading a description lastnight and I almost got the feeling that other people may see me like this. Especially at work where I am with people and in a position where the most important part of my job is advocating for individuals with disabilities, I find this to be true. I also related to something written about a "silly switch." I definitely have that, and I've been asked many times if I'm drunk when I'm really just being silly. I wonder about having many friends. I only really believe I have a couple close friends, but other people seem to seek me out because they think I can help them. Then again, with some SJs (i.e. my mother) I acquire titles such as crack-head, bizarre, insane, cold, a know-it-all, and aloof.

Personality tests always show me to be a very strong introvert (close to 100%), though, and a fairly strong thinker.

Just wondering if anybody has some thoughts on why this might be?

[Boneca]

I don't think it's strange at all. MBTI is about your preferences, not how you are all the time.
I actually think it's funny to act totally different at times. I can be very outgoing at a party or take leadership in a group, just because I can. It tires me, and I will probably lock myself up in my room the whole next day to recharge, but people who don't know me well wouldn't know that.
A lot of my old schoolmates would probably think I'm ENTP, and some friends' friends might even think I am ESTP *shudder*.

It really brings up the question whether it's possible at all to type others.

[CeSoirNoir]

I OFTEN feel as though I'm an ENFP/ENFJ/INFP.

[Edmond Zedo]

amphetamine psychosis

[INTrPosr]

It's refreshing to know that others have this problem. As of late, I have been NFing alot, and being more INFJ and ENFP. Phew..... thought I was having a momentary mental breakdown.

[cjs55]

The only type I'm ever similar too is INFP, and I'm ~always~ similar to it, not just occasionally.

I think it represents a lack of adapatibility that really hurts me sometimes.

[synchronous]

I suppose one can view the MBTI system like one would treat the Enneagram - apply subtypes. Conceive some hybrid system - 'INTPWinfp'. Perhaps there is some similar integration/dinsintegration energy triad - with functional preferences varying depending on your stress level. A 5w4 INTP in times of stress would experience the energy of a 7W8 ENTP. Something along this line. Maybe as a group, this could be a pet project - nail down some INTP sub-type system based the combination of MBTI descriptions. Hoping this makes some sense as I'm multi-tasking here trying to write down comments and cook supper :)

[Arctic Skunk]

Hmm... I'm also similar to INFP, I actually tested as INFP first and thought I was one for awhile. I kinda wonder how one can be borderline on a primary function.... I remember taking a test somewhere that measured individual functions (Ti Te Si Se etc) and I tested highest on Ti and Fi... how could my strongest function be almost tied on introverted thinking and introverted feeling? Or maybe shadow functions have a strange sense of pervading our minds? Do shadow functions reverse order or something?

[Boneca]

I suppose one can view the MBTI system like one would treat the Enneagram - apply subtypes. Conceive some hybrid system - 'INTPWinfp'. Perhaps there is some similar integration/dinsintegration energy triad - with functional preferences varying depending on your stress level. A 5w4 INTP in times of stress would experience the energy of a 7W8 ENTP. Something along this line. Maybe as a group, this could be a pet project - nail down some INTP sub-type system based the combination of MBTI descriptions. Hoping this makes some sense as I'm multi-tasking here trying to write down comments and cook supper :)I thought all women were able to do ten things at the same time! </sarcasm>
Anyway, I had a longwinded theory on Jungian functions, but it didn't turn out the way I wanted, so nevermind. I'll try to cook up something else.

I assume that all people can sometimes use all the different "letters" (E/I, N/S etc.), so it's just a matter of which order they would use them.
Wouldn't the strength of our preferences be enough to predict that order? (Not just that one test said you have 35,262% preference for I, but you'd probably know yourself in which order your preferences are).

For me, having weak P, quite weak I, quite strong N and very strong T, that would then make me get something like this order:
INTP, INTJ, ENTP, ENTJ, ISTP, INFP, ISTJ, ESTP, INFJ, ENFP, ESTJ, ENFJ, ISFP, ISFJ, ESFP, ESFJ.
Reading the descriptions of these profiles, most of it makes sense.

Then we just need to add the social pressure variable to this. People may choose f.ex. E or J more often than predicted simply because it's expected of them.
As a funny experiment I'll try to rearrange my preferences according to how I think I would act in real life (social pressure included).

INTP, ENTP, INTJ, ENTJ, ESTP, ISTP, ENFP, ISTJ, ENFJ, INFP, INFJ, ESTJ, ISFP, ESFP, ISFJ, ESFJ.

So what did change from the prediction (based on my INTP test score)? I selected E..P types over I..J types. The reason for that is probably that I have over the years had a lot of E..P friends who have forced me to be social.

OK, this was my little social theory. Any comments?

[Boneca]

Hmm... I'm also similar to INFP, I actually tested as INFP first and thought I was one for awhile. I kinda wonder how one can be borderline on a primary function.... I remember taking a test somewhere that measured individual functions (Ti Te Si Se etc) and I tested highest on Ti and Fi... how could my strongest function be almost tied on introverted thinking and introverted feeling? Or maybe shadow functions have a strange sense of pervading our minds? Do shadow functions reverse order or something?Jung's functions don't make sense to me. I think I use Ti and Ni the most. That makes me INTP/INTJ, but according to what I've read of Jung's theories I'm unbalanced and/or don't exist.

[Nighthawk]

I masqueraded as an INTJ/ENTJ while I was in the military. Not sure if a P can survive there, unless he/she is the flamboyant tactical genius (Patton or Rommel) Artisan type. I tested as INTJ until a few years after I became a civilian, and have tested INTP ever since then.

[SheepDog]

MBTI is about your preferences, not how you are all the time.

Quoting for emphasis.

[melancholeric]

Hmm... I'm also similar to INFP, I actually tested as INFP first and thought I was one for awhile.

That's what happened to me aswell. But the INFP descriptions don't fit. Sure I see the world through rose-colored glasses... 8O Not.

According to MMDI I am INTJ due to dominant Ni with secondary Ne and Te instead of Te. (Indeed all functions are pretty much introverted except iNtuition which is both i and e...) I suppose that makes me an INTP. Paul James' essay describes me fairly well, excluding the parts about "underdeveloped" feeling.

8O This smiley is cool. 8O

[NGene]

Hmm... I'm also similar to INFP, I actually tested as INFP first and thought I was one for awhile. I kinda wonder how one can be borderline on a primary function.... I remember taking a test somewhere that measured individual functions (Ti Te Si Se etc) and I tested highest on Ti and Fi... how could my strongest function be almost tied on introverted thinking and introverted feeling? Or maybe shadow functions have a strange sense of pervading our minds? Do shadow functions reverse order or something?
Although the MBTI is (supposedly) based on Jung's typology, I don't think the MBTI is exactly true to Jung's theories. That's why I tend to treat those two as completely different personality typing systems. Things get way too confusing when you try to combine the two.

The way I view the MBTI, is four different scales. So, you have the T-F scale, for example. Depending on your personality, you're somewhere between the two extremes. You may be distinctively closer to T than F, or you might be almost inbetween, preferring both T and F about as much. The same goes to the other three scales as well.

When I think in terms of Jung's functions, I have the idea that although your dominant function is Ti, you might have an exceptionally well-developed Fi as well.

These theories are, of course, just my own ideas and interpretations. They're productions of my Ne, you see. :D

[NGene]

Do you ever feel like an ENFP? In certain settings or even just that other people might think you are? I was reading a description lastnight and I almost got the feeling that other people may see me like this.
Oh yeah, I very often feel, think, and behave like an ENFP.

When I was younger (between ages 13-16) I was very distinctively an introvert and a thinker. People used to call me a "genius" or "intellectual."

These days I'm much more social and actually need the company of people. I behave more often like an extravert and a feeler, and many people have thought I was an extravert.

[Boneca]

Oh yeah, I very often feel, think, and behave like an ENFP.

When I was younger (between ages 13-16) I was very distinctively an introvert and a thinker. People used to call me a "genius" or "intellectual."

These days I'm much more social and actually need the company of people. I behave more often like an extravert and a feeler, and many people have thought I was an extravert.Couldn't this be just a part of growing up? NGene, you are in your early twenties, aren't you? (Correct me if I'm wrong!)
I had a similar experience. As a teenager I was clearly INTP (with J-ish tendencies in my case), but at about 17-18, I started to act more extrovert. At first I acted more like an ESTP, but then around 20, I became almost NF-ish, with lots of lofty ideals. I became vegetarian, started working for an animal shelter and believed in a lot of whacky stuff, like telepathy and reincarnation. If I hadn't also been a computer nerd, it wouldn't surprise me if people would have thought I was an ENFP.
Two years ago, at 23, I started to change back to my old logical, loner personality again, and now I'm back, full circle, to INTP. And, trust me, it felt like coming home after a long trip!
I see it as a nice experience - I have had my extroverted fun, I have had my idealistic youth moments, but now I'm ready to live the rest of my life as myself.

It's quite funny actually. When I was 20, I couldn't understand the way I reasoned when I was 16, I thought I was way too cynical. Today, I understand perfectly well how I thought as a 16-year-old, but I find my 20-year-old self a bit naive. :D

[waxwing]

Wow.

Interesting, so I wonder if all this "growing up", assimilating, and adapting is actual change at the core, or if it's just exploration, in a sense. You see, cause when I think "definitely ENFP," I end up feeling compelled to come back to my Ti as a sort of filtering through of everything I've just experienced. I see that I trust Ti the most. All these functions seem to be in flux, huh. And what's cool is that after having an especially "Feeling" day, my other functions, especially Thinking and Intution, seem sharper. So...maybe all the different manifestations of thought, feeling, behavior, etc. are increasingly solidifying the core.

Every comment has been helpful. I should shut up and listen some more.

[waxwing]

Oh yeah, I very often feel, think, and behave like an ENFP.

When I was younger (between ages 13-16) I was very distinctively an introvert and a thinker. People used to call me a "genius" or "intellectual."

These days I'm much more social and actually need the company of people. I behave more often like an extravert and a feeler, and many people have thought I was an extravert.

Fascinating. I can relate to you.

I guess for me it totally depends on the company, though. But lately even with people I don't relate to, I try to think...."Okay, I can learn something from them."

Do you feel the need to validate your experiences? NGene, or anybody....

[Clara]

These theories are, of course, just my own ideas and interpretations. They're productions of my Ne, you see. :D
And what a welcome breath of air they are. :cheers: for your Ne, and for underscoring the distinctions between basic preference, and using all one's potential. I've also found that to be true.

I wasn't at all surprised about "your ENFP side" - because this forum "feels" to me like the most successful ENFP-hosted gatherings I've experienced (after which everyone wonders why all events can't be like that...?) :D Thanks.

[SheepDog]

My ENFP side is my wife.

[Edmond Zedo]

Don't mistake type balancing for type change. Keirsey talks about this in PUM2, IIRC (I read it somewhere). I've gone quite a bit toward center in E/I and J/P since I was 18 or 20. A little in S/N, but none in T/F. My intuition tells me that someones type is most prominent in early adulthood, and if they lead a rounded life thereafter, they'll balance.

I can see E/I being primarily decided by environment up to around age 5, but think we're probably more born to our place in the other three scales. After 5, it's fixed unless maybe you receive massive brain damage.

In youth, I defined avoidant. I was an only child, didn't even see my dad that often, so my people skills were underdeveloped, to say the least. Since I wasn't good with people, I didn't bother. Over the years, contact increased normally, through school, work, the occasional friends. Now, some are surprised if I say I'm introverted, because I'm very much the "playful imp" INTP with those I know. But not extrovert...And I am still reserved around strangers.

Around three years ago I decided to be more responsible with regard to work, because being a reckless slacker had done me some harm there. I changed, and am just about midway between my former self and a real J. Still P. It's balancing.

[SheepDog]

I hear what you're saying about balance, Edmund Zedo, but I have been thinking of the change that happens over time as more of an 'and' than an 'or'. I haven't decided if that distinction is independent of the idea of balance or not. Just curious what you think about the and/or thing.

[Clara]

My ENFP side is my wife.
I know! (that's so great - it really shows on you, too :) )

I also think it's very much an "and" thing... I'll leave the debating of it to you, though :)

[Edmond Zedo]

I hear what you're saying about balance, Edmund Zedo, but I have been thinking of the change that happens over time as more of an 'and' than an 'or'. I haven't decided if that distinction is independent of the idea of balance or not. Just curious what you think about the and/or thing.

I think it depends more on how you look at it. By technical definitions, one can't become more extroverted without becoming less introverted. It's like adding night without subtracting day. But new ability to behave in certain manners could be called an addition to your wardrobe of personality.

[Vagabond]

But new ability to behave in certain manners could be called an addition to your wardrobe of personality. That's how I see it too... I *think* balance is more of an ability to be more flexible and less fixated on your basic functions... like, you will still be an iNtuitive, but you will be able to bring your Sensorish side on the surface and act on it if it is needed... it doesn't make you less of an intuitive, it just adds the ability to open up to your "shadow" functions (forgive my english at 6.15 am :huh: ).

What I have noticed in my case, is a weird twist between my introverted and extraverted functions though... like, I am not an INTx, because I am definitely more P than J overall, but I have noticed I switch from TiNe to NiTe a lot and I relate equally to the INTP and the INTJ profiles, having the same number of "blind spots" in both. Oh anyway. I am rambling. Sleepy...

[SheepDog]

I think this points out a possible conflict in terms. If type pairs represent a preference, then that seems like more of an 'or'. If type pairs represent skill or abilities, then that's separate from preference, more like your wardrobe analogy (an 'and'?). I've always thought of type as describing preferences, which could change, but not necessarily because you developed an auxilary preference.

Now if my preference is due to a lack of skill in an area, then developing that area may make my preference change due to new confidence. But it is just as possible that I can develop, say, my J traits without developing less of a preference for P.

I'm not arguing, just considering, fwiw.

[Edmond Zedo]

I think this points out a possible conflict in terms. If type pairs represent a preference, then that seems like more of an 'or'. If type pairs represent skill or abilities, then that's separate from preference, more like your wardrobe analogy (an 'and'?). I've always thought of type as describing preferences, which could change, but not necessarily because you developed an auxilary preference.

Now if my preference is due to a lack of skill in an area, then developing that area may make my preference change due to new confidence. But it is just as possible that I can develop, say, my J traits without developing less of a preference for P.

I'm not arguing, just considering, fwiw.

Here's the thing. It is a scale, and adding E subtracts I. But the ability to alternate and vary the degree at will is a skill, and an addition if compared to yourself without that ability.

[Clara]

I don't think we need to futher complicate the types... =P ... I do think it's not a bad thing that not all of our "N"ing fits neatly into logic - and at the same time, I really appreciate the various exhortations to test what exactly we're saying. :)

Unfortunately, some of the explanations are going to take a lot longer than is reasonable to impose on everybody else. Nevertheless, I thought maybe it'd be better to explain my "you wear it (ENFP) well" to SheepDog. Well, when SheepDog mentioned his wife, a part of a song hummed along in my mind:
(parenthetical note, because I did look it up: the pronouns had changed from the original, and, it was published in 1961 - ... so let's forget any tv show.)

If you want her to be
Always by your side
Take her hand tonight
Swallow your foolish pride and
Tell her that you're never gonna leave her
Tell her that you're always gonna love her
Tell her, tell her, tell her, tell her right now

I must add: the only way to test this kind of impression - is to ask the person, e.g. "SheepDog, does this not say a part of how you feel, about your wife? - Because that's the impression I get..."

By the way, if someone would like to read a short passage by a son about his father (Bert Berns, author of the song) see Brett Berns' entry (#21) in
http://www.creativepitch.com/archive/digest/d869.htm

[SheepDog]

Clara, I'm grateful for you taking the time to clarify that statement. I did not fully 'get' what you were saying in the first post, I guessed it was more aloof than it actually was. I'm honored by what you're saying.

[Clara]

Putting a second paragraph first: SheepDog, I wanted to tell you - to celebrate, actually - how much that shows, in what you write. It's easy to see, when you're sounding like INTP, and ENFP, often at the same time, that you're humming along on a frequency that you've practiced (language takes time) with your wife... We're the ones who are honoured - this is a special time for you, and you're transmitting that....

:) who're you calling a loof??? (my difficulty is more in reining in a natural - in French we say, "didn't steal it" - bent toward celebrating the inherent heartbreaking goofiness of life; and I don't find writing easier than talking - and, yet, this is on my daily list of things, these days)