Mexican Pesos Being Spent in America

[FranG]

I saw on the news today that a few companies were taking Mexican Pesos from illegal immigrants and given them American currency for change. I was like wtf? Is that even legal (the news reporter asked the same question)? They're trying to make them as comfortable as possible. Anyone think this is a big deal?

[earwax]

I bet the companies are giving them crappy exchange rates.

[FranG]

Yeah probably

[ptGatsby]

I saw on the news today that a few companies were taking Mexican Pesos from illegal immigrants and given them American currency for change. I was like wtf? Is that even legal (the news reporter asked the same question)? They're trying to make them as comfortable as possible. Anyone think this is a big deal?

From what I understand;

American currency is the legal monetary standard, meaning that one must accept it as payment (not sure if *must* is the right word, but I think it is). Likewise, change can always be made in american currency (as a result of it being the monetary standard).

Companies can offer money exchanging services independent from this. For example, restaurants around here allow you to pay with American dollars (1.10-1.15 standardly) but get canadian change back.

It isn't that unusual.

[FranG]

^^^
Yeah you're probably right. It seems illegal but I guess when you think about it, foreign currency is just an asset and a business can accept whatever asset it wants for payment. I think the rule is the Dollar must be accepted in payment of debts, meaning someone cannot refuse to take your dollar within the U.S. to settle an account. Imma double check on that though.

[eyebyte_atWork]

I saw on the news today that a few companies were taking Mexican Pesos from illegal immigrants and given them American currency for change. I was like wtf? Is that even legal (the news reporter asked the same question)? They're trying to make them as comfortable as possible. Anyone think this is a big deal?

Crazy - I saw that on the news last night (or this morning - can't remember).


I think it's a great idea. I mean for the business.

But I do not remember anything saying it was was those criminal illegal aliens.

But then again, they would call open season on them if it was legal. I am not sure why people hate immigrants (latin immigrants) so much these days. They keep to themselves and help provide cheap labor - making housing cheaper for the rest of us. Maybe it is just an excuse to hate a group. It's fashionable to hate them I think. I think that because there is no logical reason to hate them. Other groups have come here illegally too.

[starla]

I like immigrants, but hate the assholes who hire illegals. I don't think having illegals build houses makes them any cheaper, either. Most illegals are working in areas of the country where real estate is so expensive that the labor is nothing compared to the cost of the land. I don't know if illegals have overrun the construction industry in the midwest yet, but when I lived there, construction was still done by Americans, and houses were and still are dirt cheap.

But in regards to the OP, as long as those business owners are paying taxes on the pesos, there's probably nothing illegal about it.

[AllAboutSoul]

I saw on the news today that a few companies were taking Mexican Pesos from illegal immigrants and given them American currency for change. I was like wtf? Is that even legal (the news reporter asked the same question)? They're trying to make them as comfortable as possible. Anyone think this is a big deal?



YES! :mad: I can't really say more right now. I get pretty incoherent on the subject. :D

[FranG]

Slightly off topic but didn't want to start another thread.

News article reporting that Mexican military are on the borderand even crossing into U.S. territory and are aided in drug smuggling. Their intimidating the U.S. Border patrol who are incapable of defending themselves against these guys cause our government won't arm them. Furthermore, article says that U.S. Military might have even trained them. This is treason committed by criminals in our government. Here's article

-------------------

(CNSNews.com) - Gun-toting members of the Mexican military are crossing regularly into U.S. territory, where they are partnering with drug cartels and criminal gangs to protect sophisticated smuggling operations, according to Texas sheriffs and lawmakers.

Some of the Mexican infiltrators are suspected to have been trained by the U.S. military.truck

U.S. Border Patrol agents and local law enforcement officials operating along the southwestern border have come under attack from the Mexican side in recent months, with automatic gunfire frequently erupting, Rep. John Culberson (R-Texas) told Cybercast News Service.

Mexican military units and drug cartels have access to weaponry and communications equipment far more advanced than resources made available to U.S. officials on the state and federal level, Culberson said.

"The U.S. Border Patrol is telling its agents to just lay low and report on what they see," he said. "They are instructed to determine the size of the [Mexican military] unit, the number of personnel, the direction of travel." Read more... (http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewNation.asp?Page=/Nation/archive/200612/NAT20061221a.html)

[SensEye]

You guys might be shocked to hear this, but Canadian retailers will routinely accept US currency (albiet at somewhat crappy exchange rates). I think some US retailers near the Canadian border will accept Candian currency as well.

[immortalmack]

Crazy - I saw that on the news last night (or this morning - can't remember).


I think it's a great idea. I mean for the business.

But I do not remember anything saying it was was those criminal illegal aliens.

But then again, they would call open season on them if it was legal. I am not sure why people hate immigrants (latin immigrants) so much these days. They keep to themselves and help provide cheap labor - making housing cheaper for the rest of us. Maybe it is just an excuse to hate a group. It's fashionable to hate them I think. I think that because there is no logical reason to hate them. Other groups have come here illegally too.
Why don't they just enter legally. That's the whole thing. No one hates latinos. just enter the country legally and there's no fuss.But when you cross the border illegally and start draining resources for american citizens then thats the problem.

[FranG]

And when you got Mexican militia shooting at the U.S. (unarmed) border patrol, that's a problem too.

[Rajah]

Anyone think this is a big deal?No. I don't care if they accept payment in dollars, pesos, or pogo sticks. What's the problem?

[ptGatsby]

You guys might be shocked to hear this, but Canadian retailers will routinely accept US currency (albiet at somewhat crappy exchange rates). I think some US retailers near the Canadian border will accept Candian currency as well.

This is different though. Cause they are... you know... mexican.

At this rate though, it might just stop happening at the northern US border too. Xenophobic nationalism for the net economic loss!

[FranG]

No. I don't care if they accept payment in dollars, pesos, or pogo sticks. What's the problem?

It's a problem in the sense that they're taking it from illegal aliens (or that may have been the concern of the news report) who for obvious reasons have to stay anonymous. So it serves to encourage the flow of illegals from Mexico.

[ptGatsby]

It's a problem in the sense that they're taking it from illegal aliens (or that may have been the concern of the news report) who for obvious reasons have to stay anonymous. So it serves to encourage the flow of illegals from Mexico.

How hard is it to convert money in the US? I can walk downstairs and exchange money. I can cross the street. Within a KM of where I work, there must be over 20 different places that buy and sell currency, sell gold and silver and don't require anything more than... well... you walking in. Course, big city, I am downtown... but is it seriously that difficult?

[Rajah]

How hard is it to convert money in the US? I can walk downstairs and exchange money. I can cross the street. Within a KM of where I work, there must be over 20 different places that buy and sell currency, sell gold and silver and don't require anything more than... well... you walking in. Course, big city, I am downtown... but is it seriously that difficult?I'd wager not. Especially at the border.

[cafe]

But then again, they would call open season on them if it was legal. I am not sure why people hate immigrants (latin immigrants) so much these days. They keep to themselves and help provide cheap labor - making housing cheaper for the rest of us. Maybe it is just an excuse to hate a group. It's fashionable to hate them I think. I think that because there is no logical reason to hate them. Other groups have come here illegally too.
Around here, construction jobs are still considered good jobs. Cheap housing matters little if you can't get a decent-paying job. The last thing people in this depressed area want is more competition for jobs.

When I was wandering around the community college yesterday, I encountered a huge line and I was wondering what office was so messed up that it had a line like that. Then I figured out it was the line for a job fair. Hundreds of people were lined up for a shot at a factory job paying $33,000, if the rumors were correct. In a large city, that wouldn't be much, but my town's only 55,000 people.

We, as a family, dread the day truck-driving is moved to skilled labor status and immigrants are allowed to do it. Our job security and wages will go right down the toilet.

[FranG]

Well maybe cause I'm in the middle of the country. It's probably common at the border.

[aether]

Around here, construction jobs are still considered good jobs. Cheap housing matters little if you can't get a decent-paying job. The last thing people in this depressed area want is more competition for jobs.

It's even difficult to get office jobs these days at least around the LA area. I don't know if employers hire illegals but they do hire immigrants that take less pay and who might have not completed high school. It doesn't bode well for other people who have a college degree and pay their taxes.

[ptGatsby]

It's even difficult to get office jobs these days at least around the LA area. I don't know if employers hire illegals but they do hire immigrants that take less pay and who might have not completed high school. It doesn't bode well for other people who have a college degree and pay their taxes.

It's unlikely that they don't pay taxes; companies are held responsible for that nowadays.

And honestly, if someone without a HS degree can do the job nearly as well as a college graduate... *shrug* Might not be a job for college grads.

[aether]

It's unlikely that they don't pay taxes; companies are held responsible for that nowadays.

And honestly, if someone without a HS degree can do the job nearly as well as a college graduate... *shrug* Might not be a job for college grads.

Apparently it's capitalism at it's best. And they compete well to since they are hard workers, will do anything, are more detail oriented and probably better sales people than we are.

[ptGatsby]

Apparently it's capitalism at it's best. And they compete well to since they are hard workers, will do anything, are more detail oriented and probably better sales people than we are.

Well, I'll agree. That is capitalism at it's best. Crushes elitism and promotes those that... well... work.

[eyebyte_atWork]

Around here, construction jobs are still considered good jobs. Cheap housing matters little if you can't get a decent-paying job. The last thing people in this depressed area want is more competition for jobs.

When I was wandering around the community college yesterday, I encountered a huge line and I was wondering what office was so messed up that it had a line like that. Then I figured out it was the line for a job fair. Hundreds of people were lined up for a shot at a factory job paying $33,000, if the rumors were correct. In a large city, that wouldn't be much, but my town's only 55,000 people.

We, as a family, dread the day truck-driving is moved to skilled labor status and immigrants are allowed to do it. Our job security and wages will go right down the toilet.

I have heard this argument before... and more recently when large amounts of programming jobs have been moved to India or managers here hire Indian programmers because they are cheaper. One of my friends, a Java programmer, has learned to resent the trend so much he refuses to associate with anyone Indian.

My response for both situations is... this world is becoming more global all the time. Get used to it. Adapt or perish.

If anyone wants to ensure their ability to make a good living - adapt and grow and quit blaming others for your inaction (not you specifically - but people who quickly adapt hate over learning to adapt).

I grew up in a small town and I heard this very argument against Mexican immigration from the very people who worked manual labor jobs. They worked these jobs because they chose to play rather than prepare for the future. I grew up with one parent (mother) and we had little in the way of money. I still matched or exceeded my peers. That's adaptation.

I am not picking on you specifically - but you brought one point I did want to address.

[eyebyte_atWork]

Why don't they just enter legally. That's the whole thing. No one hates latinos. just enter the country legally and there's no fuss.But when you cross the border illegally and start draining resources for american citizens then thats the problem.

They should enter legally - I totally agree.

But I see no-one going after Canadians who enter illegally or Chinese (and I know a few illegal Chinese chicks around here).

As far as draining American resources - blame those who send jobs, factories, and the like oversees. They have shipped more commerce out of your, and my hands, then any immigrant ever has or will. If you lost a job to an immigrant - I am sorry. But I never lacked for work and I am American. I have never not been able to find meaningful work and a decent wage. But then again - I am not too proud to work my way up the food chain.

In college I started out as a cook making minimum wage (the min wage of 1990 - less than today's). Now I make over 6 figures. No immigrant stopped me.

I personally cannot blame immigrants for wanting to do what the younger generation in the US is too stoned to do.

[johnny_kilbane]

Hmm, I just saw on the news 2 minutes ago there's a restaurant here in Denver accepting pesos. And I must say that I absolutely strongly don't care. In fact I find the whole thing fairly amusing. I have some pesos around here somewhere....

[cafe]

I have heard this argument before... and more recently when large amounts of programming jobs have been moved to India or managers here hire Indian programmers because they are cheaper. One of my friends, a Java programmer, has learned to resent the trend so much he refuses to associate with anyone Indian.

My response for both situations is... this world is becoming more global all the time. Get used to it. Adapt or perish.

If anyone wants to ensure their ability to make a good living - adapt and grow and quit blaming others for your inaction (not you specifically - but people who quickly adapt hate over learning to adapt).

I grew up in a small town and I heard this very argument against Mexican immigration from the very people who worked manual labor jobs. They worked these jobs because they chose to play rather than prepare for the future. I grew up with one parent (mother) and we had little in the way of money. I still matched or exceeded my peers. That's adaptation.

I am not picking on you specifically - but you brought one point I did want to address.
We are trying to adapt. That's why I just started school to be a med. lab tech. Once I get done with that and (hopefully) find a job, he can go back to school and do something that's not so hard on the bod and is more stable. (Right now his job is tied to the auto industry).

There's a lot of people that don't have Don's and my advantages and for them, the level to which they can adapt is extremely limited. Heck, my dad was raised in a single-parent household in poverty in the fifties and sixties. He did all the right things, joined the marines, went to school on the GI Bill to get a degree in something practical when he got back. He's kept up with technology in his field (electronic and mechanical industrial maintenance), but he's been laid off multiple times in the last ten years. Now he's pushing sixty and darn lucky to have something paying $16/hour.

Myself, I don't blame Mexicans or people of other ethnicities. Of course they're going to take the best jobs they can get. They have families, too. If we'd done right by Mexico in NAFTA, we might not have quite so many folks here looking for work.

I blame the policies of the government and the corporations who are too short-sighted to realize that when most of the country is only barely scraping by, the market for the products they sale is going to be reduced. I think it is wrong for American corporations to bypass environmental laws by manufacturing goods in under-developed countries. I think it is wrong for them to bypass labor laws by doing the same. The whole thing stinks to high heaven and is primarily benefiting a very small number of people and it's perpetuated by the law-makers who are so firmly in their pockets, if not one of them themselves.

[eyebyte_atWork]

I blame the policies of the government and the corporations who are too short-sighted to realize that when most of the country is only barely scraping by, the market for the products they sale is going to be reduced. I think it is wrong for American corporations to bypass environmental laws by manufacturing goods in under-developed countries. I think it is wrong for them to bypass labor laws by doing the same. The whole thing stinks to high heaven and is primarily benefiting a very small number of people and it's perpetuated by the law-makers who are so firmly in their pockets, if not one of them themselves.

True dat.

The people at the top who get a 10 million dollar bonus by saving their company 100 million by sending work overseas.


I hope you do well in your adaptation - I wished I had gone further - and intend to do so later.

Good luck with that (good field).

and with that - I hold no grudges against immigrants providing labor for less - after all - I like having a cheap lawn service.

If a company wants to allow pesos as payment for goods and services - I think the company is being creative in getting new customers. Probably from larger companies that send our work overseas.

In either case - we should point the finger where the fault actually lies... big companies run by the mega-wealthy. Not the pawns who are subject to them - which includes you, me, and the immigrant populace.

peace out.

[eyebyte_atWork]

Hmm, I just saw on the news 2 minutes ago there's a restaurant here in Denver accepting pesos. And I must say that I absolutely strongly don't care. In fact I find the whole thing fairly amusing. I have some pesos around here somewhere....

I want to have some pesos - I am too lazy to get foreign money.

I want to have a little of money from everywhere - I think its pretty.

Come to think of it I do have some money from Bulgaria somewhere around here.

[starla]

I grew up in a small town and I heard this very argument against Mexican immigration from the very people who worked manual labor jobs. They worked these jobs because they chose to play rather than prepare for the future. I grew up with one parent (mother) and we had little in the way of money. I still matched or exceeded my peers. That's adaptation.

This is a very narrow-minded view, IMO. There are tons of people in this country who are just too stupid to adapt and/or plan for the future. Have you ever worked with people from the ghetto? They're genuinely dumb, and there's nothing they can do about it. They are not mentally capable of doing most of the good paying jobs out there. These are the people who in the past would work manual labor, which provided them with a paycheck that they could live and raise a family on. Now, manual labor pays crap, and they still can't get those jobs since employers would rather hire illegals because they're smarter and willing to work for next to nothing. So what do you propose these people do to support themselves and their families?

The people who benefit the most from illegal immigration are the rich, and that is why politicians won't do anything about it.

[johnny_kilbane]

I want to have a little of money from everywhere - I think its pretty.


I agree.

You'll appreciate this - the South African 500 bill is great. Brilliant red bill with a cool transparent window. On one side of the bill, a majestic lion. On the other side, a graphical tribute to nuclear power!

[eyebyte_atWork]

This is a very narrow-minded view, IMO. There are tons of people in this country who are just too stupid to adapt and/or plan for the future. Have you ever worked with people from the ghetto? They're genuinely dumb, and there's nothing they can do about it. They are not mentally capable of doing most of the good paying jobs out there. These are the people who in the past would work manual labor, which provided them with a paycheck that they could live and raise a family on. Now, manual labor pays crap, and they still can't get those jobs since employers would rather hire illegals because they're smarter and willing to work for next to nothing. So what do you propose these people do to support themselves and their families?

The people who benefit the most from illegal immigration are the rich, and that is why politicians won't do anything about it.

I am from the ghetto.


And for those who cannot adapt - hate to be crude - can work at McDonalds.

immigrants who can adapt and overcome - are welcome to take high paying jobs - if they have merit.

I do not believe in socialism - I believe in meritocracy. Those who can will find their way to adapt and overcome.

I was from the ghetto.

[eyebyte_atWork]

I agree.

You'll appreciate this - the South African 500 bill is great. Brilliant red bill with a cool transparent window. On one side of the bill, a majestic lion. On the other side, a graphical tribute to nuclear power!

From my understanding the transparent window is an anti-counterfeit feature.

and I think - but am not sure - that Australia has the best anti-counterfeiting measures.

[johnny_kilbane]

Counteirfit pesos is the way! Whoo ha!

[cafe]

I am from the ghetto.


And for those who cannot adapt - hate to be crude - can work at McDonalds.

immigrants who can adapt and overcome - are welcome to take high paying jobs - if they have merit.

I do not believe in socialism - I believe in meritocracy. Those who can will find their way to adapt and overcome.

I was from the ghetto.

And when they work for McDonalds, guess who pays for subsidizing their food, their housing, their utilities, their medical care? That would be government funded programs called Food Stamps, Section 8, LIHEAP, and Medicaid.

Why yes, McDonalds, I would like to provide benefits to your employees! How did you guess???

Edit: Crap! I just looked at the website and saw that we qualify for LIHEAP. Wonder if they still have funds . . .

[aether]

This is a very narrow-minded view, IMO. There are tons of people in this country who are just too stupid to adapt and/or plan for the future. Have you ever worked with people from the ghetto? They're genuinely dumb, and there's nothing they can do about it. They are not mentally capable of doing most of the good paying jobs out there. These are the people who in the past would work manual labor, which provided them with a paycheck that they could live and raise a family on. Now, manual labor pays crap, and they still can't get those jobs since employers would rather hire illegals because they're smarter and willing to work for next to nothing. So what do you propose these people do to support themselves and their families?

The people who benefit the most from illegal immigration are the rich, and that is why politicians won't do anything about it.

Hey, I'm from the "ghetto" or what can be termed as "ghetto" by some people. I did go to college but I just can't adapt and I'm kinda stuck here, unemployed.

[starla]

I am from the ghetto.

Great, you got out of the ghetto, good for you. I'm just saying that just because you were able to overcome, doesn't mean everyone can. The intelligence of the American population is a bell curve, and most people from the ghetto are at the low end of the distribution. You probably are not. Some people don't have the mental capacity to do anything better than dig a ditch, and these are the people being screwed by illegal immigration.

The only reason illegals are so cheap to hire is because they are here ILLEGALLY! Hence, employers can get away with paying them less than minimum wage, intimidating them into working under illegal and/or unsafe conditions, not giving them benefits, not giving them worker's comp, not paying into social security, etc. It has nothing to do with their merit, everything to do with their legal status. They're not getting these jobs because they're so much better at them, they're getting them because they're so cheap to hire. I'm not arguing that they're not smarter or more hard-working than the average poor American; they are. But if they had legal status, they'd move onto better paying jobs that are more aligned with their capabilities. Their illegal status forces them to take jobs that are beneath their capability level for less money than the work is really worth, thus devaluing the skills of those legitimate workers who used to do these jobs. I don't blame the Mexicans for coming across the border to take the jobs, I blame the people who hire them, bypassing the law to make more money for themselves at the expense of the poor. And I blame politicians for doing nothing to enforce the laws that they passed and took an oath to uphold.

Outsourcing is a whole seperate issue. Generally, jobs that have been outsourced are going to people of similar skills/education/capability that can do the same job for less money. People who lose their jobs to outsourcing do need to adapt, and they are generally capable of doing so. My company is in the process of outsourcing right now, so I'm adapting as we speak. I don't think outsourcing will go on forever. Eventually, wages will catch up in developing countries and it won't be worth it for companies to ship jobs overseas anymore. I think this is already starting to happen, in fact. We just all have to roll with the punches until equilibrium is reached.

[starla]

Hey, I'm from the "ghetto" or what can be termed as "ghetto" by some people. I did go to college but I just can't adapt and I'm kinda stuck here, unemployed.

If you went to college, how are you unable to adapt? You learned something in college, right? Now go learn something else!

[ben from below]

If there is any group of people barely able to dig ditches, what they need to do is evolve.

But seriously, I've seen these kinds of people. When I was loading trucks for UPS the new guys would always get to break up box-jams on the conveyor belts and push stuff along. Every so often there would be one who didn't understand this concept. It would be fascinating to investigate how they were even able to feed themselves

[aether]

If you went to college, how are you unable to adapt? You learned something in college, right? Now go learn something else!

Yes, maam!


I blame the people who hire them, bypassing the law to make more money for themselves at the expense of

I also wanted to add that illegal immigrants probably get jobs through some type of networking, so there are employment niches that illegals may have and that citizens aren't able to enter. Just like how in some small businesses certain ethnicities prevail as employees, for example.

[FranG]

Great, you got out of the ghetto, good for you. I'm just saying that just because you were able to overcome, doesn't mean everyone can. The intelligence of the American population is a bell curve, and most people from the ghetto are at the low end of the distribution. You probably are not. Some people don't have the mental capacity to do anything better than dig a ditch, and these are the people being screwed by illegal immigration.

The only reason illegals are so cheap to hire is because they are here ILLEGALLY! Hence, employers can get away with paying them less than minimum wage, intimidating them into working under illegal and/or unsafe conditions, not giving them benefits, not giving them worker's comp, not paying into social security, etc. It has nothing to do with their merit, everything to do with their legal status. They're not getting these jobs because they're so much better at them, they're getting them because they're so cheap to hire. I'm not arguing that they're not smarter or more hard-working than the average poor American; they are. But if they had legal status, they'd move onto better paying jobs that are more aligned with their capabilities. Their illegal status forces them to take jobs that are beneath their capability level for less money than the work is really worth, thus devaluing the skills of those legitimate workers who used to do these jobs. I don't blame the Mexicans for coming across the border to take the jobs, I blame the people who hire them, bypassing the law to make more money for themselves at the expense of the poor. And I blame politicians for doing nothing to enforce the laws that they passed and took an oath to uphold.


Yes to every word of your post.



Outsourcing is a whole seperate issue. Generally, jobs that have been outsourced are going to people of similar skills/education/capability that can do the same job for less money. People who lose their jobs to outsourcing do need to adapt, and they are generally capable of doing so. My company is in the process of outsourcing right now, so I'm adapting as we speak. I don't think outsourcing will go on forever. Eventually, wages will catch up in developing countries and it won't be worth it for companies to ship jobs overseas anymore. I think this is already starting to happen, in fact. We just all have to roll with the punches until equilibrium is reached.

I'll just add here that yeah outsourcing is legal, but it's still some bullshit. That's basically our government selling us out to cater to these super rich corporations. I mean overseas workers are cheaper but Americans don't have nothing to do with that. These companies supposed to get free labor?

And wages abroad will catch up to ours after America has went into the sewer. Nothing is produced in this country anymore and our national debt is nearing the breaking point (actually it passed it along time ago but that's another subject). People acting like they can't see, but it's gonna hit the fan for America and the world soon.

[eyebyte_atWork]

Great, you got out of the ghetto, good for you. I'm just saying that just because you were able to overcome, doesn't mean everyone can. The intelligence of the American population is a bell curve, and most people from the ghetto are at the low end of the distribution. You probably are not. Some people don't have the mental capacity to do anything better than dig a ditch, and these are the people being screwed by illegal immigration.

I'll take that as a compliment and agree that many cannot adapt for various reasons.

Yes - the low IQ are being somewhat screwed. Not as much as you would think.




The only reason illegals are so cheap to hire is because they are here ILLEGALLY! Hence, employers can get away with paying them less than minimum wage, intimidating them into working under illegal and/or unsafe conditions, not giving them benefits, not giving them worker's comp, not paying into social security, etc. It has nothing to do with their merit, everything to do with their legal status. They're not getting these jobs because they're so much better at them, they're getting them because they're so cheap to hire. I'm not arguing that they're not smarter or more hard-working than the average poor American; they are. But if they had legal status, they'd move onto better paying jobs that are more aligned with their capabilities. Their illegal status forces them to take jobs that are beneath their capability level for less money than the work is really worth, thus devaluing the skills of those legitimate workers who used to do these jobs. I don't blame the Mexicans for coming across the border to take the jobs, I blame the people who hire them, bypassing the law to make more money for themselves at the expense of the poor. And I blame politicians for doing nothing to enforce the laws that they passed and took an oath to uphold.


I also blame the people who hire them.
But busting hookers will not rid the problem of the John's. My point, as is yours apparently, is that busting the hookers (illegals) is more about being politically visible - not solving a problem.



Outsourcing is a whole separate issue. Generally, jobs that have been outsourced are going to people of similar skills/education/capability that can do the same job for less money. People who lose their jobs to outsourcing do need to adapt, and they are generally capable of doing so. My company is in the process of outsourcing right now, so I'm adapting as we speak. I don't think outsourcing will go on forever. Eventually, wages will catch up in developing countries and it won't be worth it for companies to ship jobs overseas anymore. I think this is already starting to happen, in fact. We just all have to roll with the punches until equilibrium is reached.

True enough - and that will eventually extend beyond skilled labor. Adaptation will help the people who currently have an advantage.

I think we agree to some degree... but I am also concerned that you (and/or others) may actually put blame on the hookers (illegals) for wanting what we have. I have strived for better after seeing others have nice things. I wanted it - and I went after it. Meanwhile too many people I grew up with were all too happy getting high, drunk, laid, etc to do anything. In the time to come - we will become more global - if you (the rhetorical you - not actually you) are not willing or able to go for the goods - then others will. I cannot hate a person who goes for what they want. I certainly will not try to demon-ize people who are up to the challenge.

On a more personal note - if you do lose your job to outsourcing - take comfort that it won't be too long before you bounce back on your feet. It has been my experience that good developers (good IT people) are always in demand. Usually at rates higher than the outsourced people - all you have to do is demand it - and back it up with skill.

later.