How Humans Are Like Computers

[Utopmk]

From someone's blog:


Humans are like computers with extremely slow data exchange interfaces and without multitasking.

This got me thinking at simalarities between humans and computers..

My thoughts are this: RAM = Short term memory. Hard drive = Long term and stored memory. Processor = The way we take abstract data and make it into something that we understand. Electricity = The blood that runs through our veins. Cooling fan = The sweat that cools us when we over work ourselves.

Those were just the few that I could think of right off hand.

Please post more reasons why we are (or are not) like computers...

[ApeTheDog]

Bonzi Buddy = the idiots we all have to tolerate at work.
The windows registry = Trauma's (full of past experiences you can't erase)
Windows 3.1 workstation = George Bush (they're both powered up, but you can't use them for shit)

[Vagabond]

Computers have no feelings. :p

[floid]

They both tend to collect a lot of lint in the vicinity their central processing units, become overheated, and spew forth gibberish.

[garak]

Processor = The way we take abstract data and make it into something that we understand.
Not a very good correlation IMO.

[Utopmk]

Not a very good correlation IMO.

Your opinions are welcome. I also realized it when posting. :) Do you have a better correlation?

[Sackanaka]

Dude, there are indeed correlations. I've thought about them actually only recently, funny (and predictable) it should arise here.:D
The brain's neurons function through a series of rapid-fire pulses, Action Potentials (AP), that are triggered by input from other neurons or sensory organs (that convert respective data into nerve-readable pulses). The APs fire along neurons, activating them and the following neuron that it is connected to, and each of the neurons are connected to multiple dendrites of other neurons or cells connected to other tissues.
It is theorized that the firing of neurons is what triggers "thoughts". Without an appropriate amount of input to overcome the threshold required, a neuron does nothing.

Though I am a computer noob, I thought this was similar to programming in that most code relies on a basic function of true / false. The code is like the neural cell's genetic programming; what it will do under specific conditions. When the code is fed the variable "true" or "false", the output will be a specified response in accordance to its code. When a neuron receives an AP that surpasses its threshold (just like true/false; it does surpass or doesn't) then it commits to its cellular function.

Also, the brain requires certain parts that constituate a functioning brain, such as the cerebrum, cerebellum, medulla oblongata, hippocampus, amygdala, etc. However, there is much variation in exactly how the neurons interconnect, resulting in certain "Personalities", differing patterns of brain function.
Computers too require certain hardware in order to fully function as a computer, but they too can have much variation. The hardware, like neurobiology, sets the stage for software, the "personality" of a computer.

[kengoogloo]

Our brain is actually faster. The neurons are slow, but we have billions of them and they are all working in parallel.

To Sackanaka: Interesting. There is a field in Artificial Intelligence called Neural Networks, which is quite similar to what you are talking about. You may find it interesting.

[Geoff]

Human males have a hard drive? (Sorry, couldnt resist).

-Geoff

[Aryan]

Do human females have Soft warez Geoff ? :wink:

Humans know how to program in prolog.
Prolog is a language that taught computers to think like humans.

[Garyincinci]

A. The Human Brain is FAR faster than any computer currently in existance.

B. I think this was backwards....it should be how computers are like humans. Humans created computers in their own image. They have a brain (processer), a heart (power source), Memory, and on and on.

[Utopmk]

A. The Human Brain is FAR faster than any computer currently in existance.


I am thinking back just 3 or 4 weeks ago... My grandfather and I were trying to remember from what David E. Kelley show, was this "Boston Legal" a spin off from. We sat there in silence, knowing there wouldn't be any talking before one of us remembered. It was right on the tips of our tounges, and it was driving us completley mad. 30 minutes passed before I put my pride aside, and ran to the computer. Within 6 seconds the words "The Practice" came from my mouth before I had time to think about it.

Sackanaka, those were wonderful examples.

Apethedog, :rofl:, to your first reply.

[kengoogloo]

Our brain seems to be slow in certain tasks (say doing 12957293 x 2837292 or doing fast dictionary lookup) is probably because we are not designed for those tasks. We don't need to do those tasks to survive :-) Things that are almost trivial to human beings are actually very challenging for the computers, like recognizing faces, or understanding languages.

[Aryan]

The Human Brain is FAR faster than any computer currently in existance.
You arent talking of the ESFJ brain, right ?
:)

[Sackanaka]

Speedwise, I'd say that my ESFJ roommate thinks a lot faster than I; that is, he always has a lot running through his mind. I think the problem is connection issues.

[Garyincinci]

I'm talking about our subconscious mind...the one that takes in every piece of visual, auditory, olfactory and tactile sense, then in what is less than an instant, filters out 97% of it as useless information to prevent overload, and concentrates on only the 3-5% that is relative. There are some, gifted individuals, who have a higher level of perception and intuition. They are capable of noticing and processing a much larger piece of reality so to speak. These are the people who the future of mankind has been entrusted to. These are the ones who ask the questions and find the answers for the purpose of progressing mankind. Most of these individuals are not even aware of their gifts and have created little delusions to help explain them. They excel at almost everything they try do to an insatiable drive to perfect and improve.

Yet due to the oddness of their nature and the MANY eccentricities that accompany their giftedness, they are often not understood. Society can not understand them and all through their lives they hear phrases which actually repress their true nature.....

"You think too much" - The gifted interpret this as meaning that thinking as much as and as fast as they do is somehow wrong and enter willingly into distracting addictions in order to suppress their thought process. Reality: The gifted person has increased thought processes. They don't simply see the obvious perception; they look for alternative perceptions. They have the ability to see the interconnectedness of things.

"You take things so personally, you're such a drama queen" - The gifted interpret this, as meaning that feeling as much as they do is abnormal. As a defense, they will either shut these feelings off, becoming cold and insensitive, or they lose themselves inside their emotions, becoming so sensitive that even simple things such as crushing a can will set their emotions ablaze (crushing the can is in effect killing the can).

"You act like the whole world is your responsibility" - This links the above two. The gifted are hardwired at their creation with two things that most people have to spend their lives learning...they have an incredibly gifted sense of perception and they have an insatiable sense of perfectionism. From birth they have to see, feel, touch, taste, hear, think about, interpret, sympathize with and understand the purpose of everything they come in contact with. Have you ever met an adult who still veiws the world through a child’s eyes? Always seeking to understand something even though society already has an "accepted answer" for it? It is this zest, this drive, and this passion for life that allows them to think outside of the norm. Not simply questioning what is accepted, but questioning, analyzing, understanding, improving upon and trying to advance the purpose of the idea.

Their love of life enables them to be the most compassionate, caring, logical, creative and dedicated individuals you could hope to find. This was something that the universe has created, for whatever purpose, as an abnormality. The nature of this abnormality however is excellence. It is an excellence that can not be hardwired into a computer.

Our Data Exchange is superior to any computer. Computers analyze and label based on a set of rules, humans perceive and attempt to understand without rules. The gifted are exceptional examples of this. A computer may be able to understand that global warming is bad for the environment and for the society, but only humanity can personally relate to it through compassion.

[Geoff]

I think my favourite 'difference' is the way that humans do (as keng put it) computer-difficult things easily and vice versa.

Throw a ball to a robot with a computer brain. Add some side wind. Some spin from the bat. How long would the formulae take to concoct and control the answer to just that one sporting moment.

Throw a ball to a 10 year old in a park. Ok, do it again. And again. What has he/she learned?

-Geoff

[Sackanaka]

That thing about computer AI earlier;
Computers, of course, were in conception a very short while ago relative to the development of the brain throughout evolution. Yet, it's progressing in complexity with an astounding rate, thanks to the human mind.
Perhaps,
1) Computers reflect the machinations of the human mind
2) Computers will one day represent a perfect reflection (once the "learning process" is fully understood; hence my interest in bringing out the role of neurobiology)
3) We shall see who is stronger, Neo or the Terminator.

[nBT]

computers cant evolve by own will (fuck)

computers are only very good in the T department. they have no fault tolerance. humans have loads of 'fault tolerance'. some of that is 'humor'. or called 'sadness'

this is how humans learn. P > J. from lots of fault tolerance to minimal as possible. a child first learns a rough sound sequence for a word. later on is able to technically pronounce it better. in school she will learn the rules of pronounciation and grammar. humans learn one abstract 'thing'. and various sensate forms it comes in. an apple is an visual, audible, kinetic, edible object (MI). fault tolerance also enables dumping of data. wich alows humans to interact effectively with far less memory space as we can give a computer.
you can only learn computers an algoritm. not fault tolerance.
garyincinci's post is about humans with great fault tolerance. i use mine to tease people with. and think of things unthinkable to the J mind.

(note to self, stop talking bullshit)

[kengoogloo]

Yes, in the old days (say 30 years ago), computers are stupid and they can only follow the rules from the programmers. But in the advance of the recent machine learning research, computer can now learn (primitive) things through self learning, without the help from humans.

For example, let's say you have 50 pictures of cat and 50 pictures of dogs, and the task of the computer is to learn (without human guidances) to distinguish cats from dogs.

The task is easy if the computer only need to recognize those 100 pictures, as the computer can simply memorize them and recall the animal if you present a picture again. But the real task is to GENERALIZE the pattern of cats and dogs so that the computer can classify a picture that it hasn't seen before.

These kinds of tasks can somehow be solved successfully with artificial neural networks (ANN). The ANN starts with some random firing of neurons. However, they can learn by try and error. For example, you give them a dog picture, but the ANN says that it is a cat. You tell them that it is wrong, and the ANN will adjust itself so that they will be more likely to produce a correct answer next time. With these kinds of feedback mechanisms and some luck :) they can learn the cat/dog problem.

There is some interesting properties in ANN that is quite similar to human brain. For example, they are quite robust. If you kill a few neurons in the ANN, it will still works pretty OK. (Comparing to traditional program, if you change a 'plus' to a 'minus', you willl probably change the meaning of the whole program).

For those who are interested, you can read the following link:
http://www-106.ibm.com/developerworks/library/l-neural/

[Sackanaka]

Kengoogloo: I sent that link to my immunology professor who majored in neurobiology (and is rumored to be the hardest biology teacher in the undegrad dept!)
Thanks :D