The Legend of Master Legend

[Delilah]

Awesomely hilarious, or hilariously pathetic? (http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/25020634/the_legend_of_master_legend/2)


"When Master Legend bursts into a sprint, as he often does, his long, unruly hair flows behind him. His mane is also in motion when he's behind the wheel of the Battle Truck, a 1986 Nissan pickup with a missing rear window and "ML" spray-painted on the hood. He and the Ace head off to patrol their neighborhood on the outskirts of Orlando, scanning the street for evildoers. "I don't go looking for trouble," Master Legend shouts above the engine. "But if you want some, you'll get it!"

Then he hands me his business card, which says:

Master Legend
Real Life Super Hero
"At Your Service""



This is real life people, there are even super heroes in Minnesota!

Real Life Superheroes (http://www.reallifesuperheroes.org/index.html)

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j28/jstjn11/superhero.jpg
http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j28/jstjn11/superhero2.jpg

I do believe I have found my calling, now, to choose an outfit......

[MadamI'madaM]

Kind of leaves the ball in the villains' court, doesn't it?

Although I support citizen law enforcement, this is exactly the wrong way to do it.

They're pretty much stuck with smallish crimes unless they want to become sitting ducks.

Asking to get shot, if you ask me.

[Delilah]

Asking to get shot, if you ask me.

But they get costumes, and the one guys uses zip ties!

ZIP TIES!

[MadamI'madaM]

But they get costumes, and the one guys uses zip ties!

ZIP TIES!

That sounds really funny, but cops use those too sometimes.

If they're thick and on tight enough they're pretty damn impossible unless you're peaked on tweak or a bodybuilder.

[Delilah]

That sounds really funny, but cops use those too sometimes.


It's damn HI-larious! Keep in mind, he also has a cellphone.

Seriously, I got such a kick out of the whole thing it made me want to meet these silly fuckers.

[Ptah]

It is wrong that I've already picked out the "costume"/image/alter-ego I'd use if I ever felt the need to do some superhero work? You know, just in case?

[Delilah]

It is wrong that I've already picked out the "costume"/image/alter-ego I'd use if I ever felt the need to do some superhero work? You know, just in case?

Is it strange that when posting this, you were one of the (very) few people here that I thought may already be involved. :ph34r:

[rhuarch]

And so I rise from the ashes... (http://www.nbc.com/Saturday_Night_Live/video/clips/snl-digital-short-hero-song/227152/)

[Bongmaster General]

We should start a super villian listing to balance this movement out. Although I might have some trouble going up against the guy from Texas. He looks like he plays for keeps:

http://www.reallifesuperheroes.org/images_heroes/zimmer.jpg

Mostly I'm just pissed off over how the one guy pictured in the OP cleans up graffiti. That essentially means he hates ethnic minorities.

[rhuarch]

W

Mostly I'm just pissed off over how the one guy pictured in the OP cleans up graffiti. That essentially means he hates ethnic minorities.

Now there's someone falling into a stereotype prejudice. In Las Vegas at least half of the active taggers are pale as fish bellies and from affluent neighborhoods.

[MadamI'madaM]

Now there's someone falling into a stereotype prejudice. In Las Vegas at least half of the active taggers are pale as fish bellies and from affluent neighborhoods.

I agree that it's not so black and white, but is painting over tags really at the heart of fighting evil?

Unless he's personally springing for the new paint, then it sounds like he holds some irrational prejudice that could have started in the 80s with media hyped minority gang culture.

[Bongmaster General]

Now there's someone falling into a stereotype prejudice. In Las Vegas at least half of the active taggers are pale as fish bellies and from affluent neighborhoods.

I don't see the part that says "ethnic" has to refer to shared race or economic status. (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/ethnic)

Who's prejudiced?

Also, one could argue a racial connection if one wanted to without needing to demonstrate that all people involved in the graffiti movement are members of the same race or races.

At least half of all people who celebrate St. Patrick's Day aren't Irish.

Is St. Patrick's Day consequentially no longer a part of Irish culture? Would making the celebration of St. Patrick's Day illegal have nothing to do with Irish people since many non-Irish people also celebrate it?

Back on topic, being a narc is apparently a super power now. (http://www.reallifesuperheroes.org/heroes_citizensmoke.html)


Citizen Smoke has also worked as an anonymous tipster while maintaining a "transient" appearance which resulted in several arrests and assistance for at-risk individuals.

[rhuarch]

I don't see the part that says "ethnic" has to refer to shared race or economic status. (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/ethnic)

Who's prejudiced?

Also, one could argue a racial connection if one wanted to without needing to demonstrate that all people involved in the graffiti movement are members of the same race or races.

At least half of all people who celebrate St. Patrick's Day aren't Irish.

Is St. Patrick's Day consequentially no longer a part of Irish culture? Would making the celebration of St. Patrick's Day illegal have nothing to do with Irish people since many non-Irish people also celebrate it?

Back on topic, being a narc is apparently a super power now. (http://www.reallifesuperheroes.org/heroes_citizensmoke.html)

Just to be sure I understand your claim here; are your implying that taggers have achieved the status of a distinct ethnic group? Or maybe your trying to introduce ambiguity into your original argument in an effort to prop it prop it up once it comes under the weight of scrutiny.

[Bongmaster General]

Just to be sure I understand your claim here; are your implying that taggers have achieved the status of a distinct ethnic group? Or maybe your trying to introduce ambiguity into your original argument in an effort to prop it prop it up once it comes under the weight of scrutiny.

1) Who said the ethnic group in question was only about graffiti?

2) There is a distinct ethnic movement called "hip hop" which has graffiti among its well known traditions.

3) I went on to explain why I disagreed with your claim on a racial basis with my St. Patrick's Day example. Were I to need to shield my claim with ambiguity, I probably wouldn't have been able to present an effective counterargument against your claim in the context you introduced.

4) Speaking of which, you didn't dispute the St. Patrick's Day example I presented.

[rhuarch]

1) Who said the ethnic group in question was only about graffiti?

2) There is a distinct ethnic movement called "hip hop" which has graffiti among its well known traditions.

I think it might be more than a little too generous to refer to "hip hop" as a distinct ethnic group. Maybe a better label would be "Entertainment genre with associated trappings." I think your going to have to provide some supporting evidence to establish hip hop as a distinct ethnic group. Further, just because graffiti is sometimes associated with the hip hop subculture doesn't meant that it's exclusive to hip hop. Where I live, and I'm sure this is not unique to Vegas, there are and have been tagging crews associated with a wide variety of backgrounds; Latino gangs, Black gangs, one Korean group that I know of, white supremacists, and even just groups of friends with no common link other than their friendship and an urge to enjoy some deviant behavior.


1)3) I went on to explain why I disagreed with your claim on a racial basis with my St. Patrick's Day example. Were I to need to shield my claim with ambiguity, I probably wouldn't have been able to present an effective counterargument against your claim in the context you introduced.

4) Speaking of which, you didn't dispute the St. Patrick's Day example I presented.

The reason I ignored your St. Patrick's Day example is because it's a not really a relevant parallel since to my knowledge celebrating St. Patrick's Day doesn't involve the defacement of private property (at least not as a recognized institutional tradition). Not only that, but using your criteria as the standard we would have to also legalize honor killings since outlawing them would show that we "hate ethnic minorities." In fact there are a plethora of practices we would be forced to allow from groups that have a much stronger claim to recognition as distinct ethnic groups than your "hip hop" claim can support.

[Bongmaster General]

I think it might be more than a little too generous to refer to "hip hop" as a distinct ethnic group. Maybe a better label would be "Entertainment genre with associated trappings." I think your going to have to provide some supporting evidence to establish hip hop as a distinct ethnic group.

Any shared culture is a distinct ethnic group. Hip hop is a massive shared culture. Do you really want me to google up some articles that assert hip hop is a culture?

Well, here's one that happens to address both hip hop as a culture as well as the spray paint "what we think of as graffiti today" graffiti's role as a product of this hip hop culture (http://www.hiphop-network.com/articles/graffitiarticles/hiphopgraffiti.asp)

Anyway, my earlier point about race not being essential to the definition of "ethnic" was mostly just a shot at your use of "prejudice." We all make prejudiced assumptions, often times because of well known cultural connotations. Just like most people think of the racial definition when they see or hear reference to "ethnic" (a prejudice which you understandably held), there are certain connotations associated with graffiti which many think of when statements or actions are made about/against the art.

There's a big difference between something like "only Latinos spray paint graffiti" and something like "making an agenda out of targeting graffiti makes me think the guy has something against ethnic minorities." The same line of interpretation is commonly (and correctly) applied to the motive behind disproportionate crack laws in comparison to cocaine laws.


Further, just because graffiti is sometimes associated with the hip hop subculture doesn't meant that it's exclusive to hip hop. Where I live, and I'm sure this is not unique to Vegas, there are and have been tagging crews associated with a wide variety of backgrounds; Latino gangs, Black gangs, one Korean group that I know of, white supremacists, and even just groups of friends with no common link other than their friendship and an urge to enjoy some deviant behavior.

The spray paint "what we think of as graffiti today" graffiti is largely a product of the hip hop culture. Regardless of who's involved in it at any given point in time, statements or actions made about/against the art do reflect on this culture. There's no reason anything I said should imply graffiti is exclusive to hip hop. In fact, my whole St. Patrick's Day argument was all about why exclusivity isn't the case at all. It was an argument against the necessity of exclusivity in connecting an activity to a culture.


The reason I ignored your St. Patrick's Day example is because it's a not really a relevant parallel since to my knowledge celebrating St. Patrick's Day doesn't involve the defacement of private property (at least not as a recognized institutional tradition). Not only that, but using your criteria as the standard we would have to also legalize honor killings since outlawing them would show that we "hate ethnic minorities." In fact there are a plethora of practices we would be forced to allow from groups that have a much stronger claim to recognition as distinct ethnic groups than your "hip hop" claim can support.

1) St. Patrick's Day does traditionally involve drinking alcohol, which was and still is (in certain contexts/locations) considered a crime as well as a component to many other related crimes. Drinking is a recognized tradition of St. Patrick's Day.

2) Killing harms others. Graffiti doesn't.

3) Any activity which is directly harmful to others shouldn't be allowed on the basis of harm. Graffiti doesn't qualify under that criteria. Nor does drinking alcohol. Nor does smoking peyote, an activity which is legal in some areas of the US specifically because of the culture this activity is important to.

[Delilah]

Oh, wow, you guys just ....wait for it....

EPIC FAIL at enjoying the topic at hand!!!!!

So says anxiety girl.

http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z30/kalynlawl/now-im-a-superhero.jpg

[kendoiwan]

I soooo did this topic already...

[CEOofRawness]

I soooo did this topic already...

I knew this thread sounded familiar...

Considering how bad the economy is doing, I guess people are doing what they feel like is productive work.

[rhuarch]

Any shared culture is a distinct ethnic group. Hip hop is a massive shared culture. Do you really want me to google up some articles that assert hip hop is a culture?

Well, here's one that happens to address both hip hop as a culture as well as the spray paint "what we think of as graffiti today" graffiti's role as a product of this hip hop culture (http://www.hiphop-network.com/articles/graffitiarticles/hiphopgraffiti.asp)

I must admit I'm impressed. In fact I'm willing to concede your point on the basis of hip hop as a distinct ethnic group. Especially in light of the distinction the author makes between what he considers legitimate forms of graffiti vs. territorial markings from gangs. I was lumping both into my concept of graffiti. In that context I have seen some graffiti that I was profoundly sorry to see painted over, although I would still not dispute the property owners right to cover it up. In my area though artful graffiti is exceedingly rare and I harbor little sympathy with or patience for the people who leave these kinds of non-artful scribblings on other peoples' property.


Anyway, my earlier point about race not being essential to the definition of "ethnic" was mostly just a shot at your use of "prejudice." We all make prejudiced assumptions, often times because of well known cultural connotations. Just like most people think of the racial definition when they see or hear reference to "ethnic" (a prejudice which you understandably held), there are certain connotations associated with graffiti which many think of when statements or actions are made about/against the art.

Now your assuming that race is essential to the definition of prejudice.



There's a big difference between something like "only Latinos spray paint graffiti" and something like "making an agenda out of targeting graffiti makes me think the guy has something against ethnic minorities." The same line of interpretation is commonly (and correctly) applied to the motive behind disproportionate crack laws in comparison to cocaine laws.

The spray paint "what we think of as graffiti today" graffiti is largely a product of the hip hop culture. Regardless of who's involved in it at any given point in time, statements or actions made about\against the art do reflect on this culture. There's no reason anything I said should imply graffiti is exclusive to hip hop. In fact, my whole St. Patrick's Day argument was all about why exclusivity isn't the case at all. It was an argument against the necessity of exclusivity in connecting an activity to a culture.

Even granting that hip hop is a distinct culture\ethnic group and including graffiti as a major attribute of that culture, I think you're argument still doesn't address the real issue. Trying to set this up as a direct attack on an ethnic group is a straw man argument. The real issue is weather property owners have the right to dictate acceptable use of their property. If a property owner has not consented to having their property used as a canvas for graffiti, it doesn't matter how artistically expressive it is, the graffiti artist has violated the property owners rights. I have seen graffiti that I would pay to have on my own wall, but that doesn't mean graffiti artists have the right to use someone else' property as their canvas without permission.


1) St. Patrick's Day does traditionally involve drinking alcohol, which was and still is (in certain contexts/locations) considered a crime as well as a component to many other related crimes. Drinking is a recognized tradition of St. Patrick's Day.

2) Killing harms others. Graffiti doesn't.

3) Any activity which is directly harmful to others shouldn't be allowed on the basis of harm. Graffiti doesn't qualify under that criteria. Nor does drinking alcohol. Nor does smoking peyote, an activity which is legal in some areas of the US specifically because of the culture this activity is important to.

I actually agree with your argument about drugs, but I don't think it extends to graffiti. Also freedom from harm is not the only right we are entitled to, I strongly believe that we all should have the right to dictate how our own property is used, and that includes the right to deny graffiti artists the use of said property as their medium. In fact I would consider there to be very little distinction between harm to my property and harm to myself.



Oh, wow, you guys just ....wait for it....

EPIC FAIL at enjoying the topic at hand!!!!!

So says anxiety girl.
Sorry Delilah, I actually enjoyed your post very much. I just couldn't resist the urge to let myself get drawn into an engaging debate (I am INTP after all)

[Bongmaster General]

@ Rhuarch

I don't think we're disagreeing on too much anymore. There isn't a ton of evidence for the guy being a racist/ethnic oppressor/whatever; it's just weird he would go out of his way to be an anti-graffiti vigilante.

My only last major point of contention is your straw man accusation. The quotes of mine you cited were going directly off of claims you made. The first part was a further defense in response to your initial comment about my falling victim to stereotype prejudice. The second part was a counterargument for your bringing up how members of different races involve themselves in the activity in question.

For my quotes to be setting up a straw man argument, I'd have had to misrepresent your argument with a different (presumably less effective) argument. I don't believe you could make that claim. You could argue that the heart of the issue is whether graffiti is, at least in most cases, objectively worthy of treatment as a crime, but that doesn't amount to my very specific responses to your very specific points being a straw man argument.

[Corbin]

INTPc Super Villains sub forum please.

We can't let them run around in their sexy tights without someone in more revealing tights and a gun forming a masterful plot (though sufficiently filled up with bigger loopholes than the ring of a blue whale condom) to stop them.

[Delilah]

Sorry Delilah, I actually enjoyed your post very much. I just couldn't resist the urge to let myself get drawn into an engaging debate (I am INTP after all)

Don't be sorry, it gave me an excuse to use EPIC FAIL and that picture, both of which cracked me up.


INTPc Super Villains sub forum please.


Brilliant!

Wait, if I like it, it is practically a guarantee we will never get it.

Um. Forget it, it's a horrible idea, I hate it.

/serious face