From what place do you think the new Pope will be originating?

[Tlalocone]

I Don't mind just be a good Pope as or be similar to John Paul II.

Skin color doesn't matter.:)

[Claverhouse]

I rather think Cardinal Ratzinger, Grand Inquisitor, is likely.

He also has his own Fan Club (http://www.ratzingerfanclub.com/) on the web...

He's very ideologically pure:


1939Ratzinger enters the minor seminary in Traunstein, the initial step of his ecclesiastical career. 1943Ratzinger, along with the rest of his seminary class, is drafted into the Flak [anti-aircraft corps]. He is still allowed to attend classes at the Maximilians-Gymnasium in Munich three days a week. 1944September: Having reached military age, Ratzinger is released from the Flak and returns home, only to be drafted into labor detail under the infamous Austrian Legion ("fanatical ideologues who tyrannized us without respite").
November: Ratzinger undergoes basic training with the German infantry. Due to illness he finds himself exempt from most of the rigors of military duty. 1945Spring (end of April or beginning of May): As the Allied front draws closer, Ratzinger deserts the army and heads home to Traunstein. When the Americans finally arrive at his village, they choose to establish their headquarters in the Ratzinger house. Josef is identified as a German soldier and incarcerated in a POW camp.
June 19: Ratzinger is released and returns home to Traunstein, followed by his brother Georg in July.
November: Ratzinger and his brother Georg re-enter the seminary. ...

1953July: Ratzinger receives his doctorate in theology from the University of Munich. In connection with his doctoral studies he produces his first important work: Volk und Haus Gottes in Augustins Lehre von der Kirche [People and House of God in Augustine's doctrine of the Church].Ratzinger devotes his Habilitationsschrift -- book-length contribution to original research in order to teach at the university level -- to Bonaventure's theology of history and revelation.

1959April 15: Ratzinger begins lectures as full professor (one holding a chair) of fundamental theology at the University of Bonn.
August 23: Ratzinger's father passes away. 1962 - 1965Ratzinger is present during all four sessions of the Second Vatican Council as a peritus, or chief theological advisor to Cardinal Josef Frings of Cologne, Germany. ...

1968 A wave of student uprisings sweeps across Europe, and Marxism quickly becomes the dominant intellectual system at Tübingen, indoctrinating not only his students but many of the faculty as well. Witnessing the subordination of religion to Marxist political ideology, Ratzinger observes: There was an instrumentalization by ideologies that were tyrannical, brutal, and cruel. That experience made it clear to me that the abuse of faith had to be resisted precisely if one wanted to uphold the will of the Council [Salt of the Earth]. ...

1977

On March 24, Ratzinger is named Archbishop of Munich and Freising. He is urged by his confessor to accept the office and chooses as his episcopal motto the phrase from the third letter of John, "Co-Worker of the Truth," reasoning:For one, it seemed to be the connection between my previous task as teacher and my new mission. Despite all the differences in modality, what is involved was and remains the same: to follow truth, to be at its service. And because in today's world the theme of truth has all but disappeared, because truth appears too great for man, and yet everything falls apart if there is no truth. [Milestones, p. 153].He is ordained May 28.
June 27 - Ratzinger is elevated to Cardinal of Munich by Pope Paul VI. 1980 Ratzinger is named by Pope John Paul II to chair the special Synod on the Laity. Shortly after, the pope asks him to head the Congregation for Catholic Education. Ratzinger declines, feeling he shouldn't leave his post in Munich too soon. 1981 On November 25, Ratzinger accepts Pope John Paul II's invitation to take over as Prefect for the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith.
After that the biography stops, leaving us in suspense as to what he's been up to for the last 25 years.

Not being a catholic though, it's none of my business.



Claverhouse :ph34r:


[ I know it's unfair: but the bit above about the nazis '("fanatical ideologues who tyrannized us without respite").' does posit a slight lack of irony in the apologists for the Catholic Church. ]

[PonderBee]

Mexico - the 51st US state

You left off North America

[mgb]

Mexico - the 51st US state

You left off North America

He won't be from North America. They can't afford it.

The new Pope will probably be a dark horse.

[PonderBee]

The new Pope will probably be a dark horse.
D'ya mean F. Arinze from Africa?
It would be fun to watch my inlaws and neighbors react to a newly chosen Pope with such a dark complexion! My guess is that it will be a latino.

Is there a prize for the closest pick?!

[Swift]

You left off North AmericaThe Pope comes traditionally from a small, less influential country. The US or Canada can forget having a pope one day.

Swift

[coffeezombie]

Someday a Bush will bomb the Vatican and then we'll have a Pope of our own!

[ohnoaninfp]

FROM IRELAND !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Dunearhp]

I like the sound of the Belgian frontrunner, but I don't know if it is very likely.

Not being catholic, I shouldn't care, but since the pope is so influencial, I do anyway.

[Geoff]

How about from England! Oh, no, we got excommunicated ;)

-Geoff

[Swift]

How about from England! Oh, no, we got excommunicated ;)It looks like you Brits don't want to belong to anything. :rolleyes: B) ;)

[Jacque]

Things might be setting up for the Antichrist, a great pretender to the Papacy. Or My Pope is an Alien.

[Lee]

I think we should have a virtual pope, an online program that all can access for advice through www.moreholythanthou.com. (http://www.moreholythanthou.com.)

What? I am being dead serious.

[Claverhouse]

Um, I gave up most SF, but I remember one story, probably Blish or Aldiss, about having a perpetual robot Pope. It's set with it blessing the crowds in St. Peter's.

I can see the disadvantages; as with most perpetual things, and with robots particularly.



Claverhouse :ph34r:

[Tlalocone]

Mexico - the 51st US state

You left off North America
No. I included in the notion of U.S.
(i APOLOGIZE& I AM sorry if it boders Northern Americans including U.S. inhabitants) (Please forgive it to me.):blush:

[Tlalocone]

Is there a prize for the closest pick?!

No. SADLY NOT. ALL Spanish Americans becoming capitalists and Money oriented people?(Are you a New-Mexican inhabitant???):) :devil: :smooch:

[Tlalocone]

Someday a Bush will bomb the Vatican and then we'll have a Pope of our own!
'A' Bush? I had though Bush II. (G. W. Bush) has only 2 daughters. So Who would be Bush (the) III.???:) :devil: :blink:

[Tlalocone]

How about from England! Oh, no, we got excommunicated ;)

-Geoff

YES,YES You SHOULD thank it to Henry (the) VIII.

What do you want as an Anglican, bloke(-y)?:mad: ;P :smooch:

[crule81]

How about from England! Oh, no, we got excommunicated ;)

-Geoff

You guys excommunicated yourself. It's funny that the Kings and Queens of Britain still use the title "Defender of the Faith" which was given to Henry VIII by the Pope for refuting Martin Luther.

RATZINGER WILL BE THE NEXT POPE. I GUARANTEE IT. ;P

[Thermo]

I Don't mind just be a good Pope as or be similar to John Paul II.
GLOBAL pedophile scandals
intolerance
sexism
homophobia
an unhealthy sexual attitude
infallibility

I wouldn't define any of those traits as "good." Don't worry though, I am sure the next pope will be as reactionary and stuck in a time warp as John Paul II was. If Jesus were alive today the Roman Catholic Church would be first in line to nail him to a cross.

[Claverhouse]

'A' Bush? I had though Bush II. (G. W. Bush) has only 2 daughters. So Who would be Bush (the) III.???:) :devil: :blink:

Jeb.



Claverhouse :ph34r:

[ohnoaninfp]

Naw, People like you (Thermo) would have beaten the rest of the world to crucify him. You do it so well to other people. As far as England goes, remember Oliver Cromewell ( bastard who is burning in hell) , who murdered Thousands of Irish Catholics. Maybe thats the reason why England got excommunicated. An Irish pope would be awesome! Not only would he raise morale in Ireland, but he would probably settle the whole confilict in Northern Ireland peacefully, So that the Catholics and protestants there could stop killing eachother in the name of Christ, even though it wasn't really about Christ at all. It is more of a political thing.

[Dunearhp]

If Jesus were alive today the Roman Catholic Church would be first in line to nail him to a cross.

That is what he is there for after all.

[Maskedone]

I wouldn't define any of those traits as "good." Don't worry though, I am sure the next pope will be as reactionary and stuck in a time warp as John Paul II was. If Jesus were alive today the Roman Catholic Church would be first in line to nail him to a cross.


Wouldn't bet on it. The Catholic Church is actually growing up. They're moving at a snail's pace but they are actually growing up. If we want the first in line to take him out then there are probably sects in the US south that fit the bill far better than the current Catholics. The Catholic Church may be on the list but it would only reach first if you count its reach and organization as deciding factors. He's not liable to be crucified (barring a heavy dose of divine interference in mortal thinking) regardless. That punishment has mostly faded away. If a modern faith were to go after him then the charge would be either heresy or sorcery and if my memory serves then the typical punishments for either tends toward either hanging or burning at the stake. The executioners could of course skip tradition but then I'd expect the killing to be less formal not more formal. As such a gun or a knife would fit. Crucifixion while once modified to fit the needs of the Church when it came to torture is not typically a method of execution that Christianity favors as far as I know.

[Chicken]

the new p0p3 will be a vieanna sausage...

[Thermo]

That is what he is there for after all.

Funny, but you missed the point.

[Thermo]

Naw, People like you (Thermo) would have beaten the rest of the world to crucify him. You do it so well to other people. As far as England goes, remember Oliver Cromewell ( bastard who is burning in hell) , who murdered Thousands of Irish Catholics. Maybe thats the reason why England got excommunicated. An Irish pope would be awesome! Not only would he raise morale in Ireland, but he would probably settle the whole confilict in Northern Ireland peacefully, So that the Catholics and protestants there could stop killing eachother in the name of Christ, even though it wasn't really about Christ at all. It is more of a political thing.
I don't get what my statement has to do with the Irish.

[Thermo]

Wouldn't bet on it. The Catholic Church is actually growing up. They're moving at a snail's pace but they are actually growing up. If we want the first in line to take him out then there are probably sects in the US south that fit the bill far better than the current Catholics. The Catholic Church may be on the list but it would only reach first if you count its reach and organization as deciding factors. He's not liable to be crucified (barring a heavy dose of divine interference in mortal thinking) regardless. That punishment has mostly faded away. If a modern faith were to go after him then the charge would be either heresy or sorcery and if my memory serves then the typical punishments for either tends toward either hanging or burning at the stake. The executioners could of course skip tradition but then I'd expect the killing to be less formal not more formal. As such a gun or a knife would fit. Crucifixion while once modified to fit the needs of the Church when it came to torture is not typically a method of execution that Christianity favors as far as I know.
You are taking me a little to literally. My point is the modern Catholic Church is very similiar to the Religious authorities Jesus fought for social and religious equality. Jesus also repeatedly fought for following the spirit of the rules and not the rules for there own sake. Clearly the Roman Catholic Church would oppose Jesus on both accounts. It is ironic that an established ultra-conservative oprganization claims to worship a radical ultra-liberal.

[athman]

The smart money is on Pope George Ringo now that Pope John Paul has gone.


Actually I like ohnohaninfp's idea - an irish pope would be a good thing

[Tlalocone]

GLOBAL pedophile scandals.
GLOBAL pedophile scandals: Yes, in and from North America!

[ohnoaninfp]

I don't get what my statement has to do with the Irish.

The Part about the Irish was a response to the statement the England got excommunicated.

[Thermo]

GLOBAL pedophile scandals: Yes, in and from North America!
1.) I guess if they are only pedophiles in North America its ok? Take a look at the damage....

http://www.remnantofgod.org/rccsex.htm

Current estimates of Roman Catholic priests in the U.S.= 49,000 to 50,000
Estimates of pedophile priests = 3,000 (6.1%) to 8,000 (16.3%)

188 Dioceses in the U.S. Divide 3,000 by 188 = 16 perpetrators per diocese
Divide 8,000 by 188 = 42 perpetrators per diocese

Current experts claim a pedophile could abuse 200-265 children in a lifetime.
200 x 16 perps/diocese = 3,200 victims/diocese
200 x 42 perps/diocese = 8,400 victims/diocese
3,200 victims/diocese x 188 dioceses = 601,600 victims in U.S.
8,400 victims/diocese x 188 dioceses = 1,579,200 victims in U.S.

Average American family consists of 4-6 people
(3,200 victims/diocese) 601,600 victims x 4 family members = 2,406,400 indirect victims
60l,000 victims x 6 family members = 3,609,600 indirect victims
(8,400 victims/diocese) 1,579,200 x 4 family members = 6,316,800 indirect victims
1,579,200 x 6 family members = 9,475,200 indirect victims

These numbers are a reflection of immediate family only and do not reflect the indirect victims within the parishes that are affected.

188 Bishops are responsible for the pain of at least 601,600 direct victims and as many as 9,475,200 indirect victims — a total of as many as 10,076,800 people. Clearly, something is wrong.

Using the lower numbers the number of direct victims and survivors alone could populate a city larger than Boston. Using the higher numbers, it would be the fourth largest city in the U.S.— one between the size of Houston and Chicago..


http://quinnell.us/religion/bad/hypocrisy.html
6.9.02 - The Roman Catholic Church has removed 218 priests from their positions this year because of child sexual abuse allegations, but at least 34 known offenders remain in church jobs, a Washington Post survey reported.


2.) It is a global problem. Here are a few examples.
http://www.thelinkup.org/crimes00i2.html
FRANCE CAEN - A French court sentenced a Catholic priest to 18 years in prison for raping and molesting teen-agers and children entrusted to his care.

IRELAND DUBLIN — A retired priest was sentenced to 12 years in prison after pleading guilty to abusing altar boys, court officials said.

LONDON, England - A Roman Catholic priest was jailed for 30 months for sexually abusing seven boys at his church in south London between 1977 and 1983.

[Claverhouse]

The Part about the Irish was a response to the statement the England got excommunicated.
We didn't get excommunicated, the Church of England ( which inter alia is still part of the catholic tradition: but reformed ) was set up as the state church. The papacy never placed a ban on us as a result --- no point if you no longer belong to the Roman communion: whereas they did under King John > no-one could be buried etc., when we were still part of the Roman Church ( then the Pope made it up with John, and rightly annulled the disgusting Magna Carta for him ) --- There is no reason why an English catholic should not again be elected as Pope. Our last one gave Ireland to England.



Claverhouse :ph34r:

[ohnoaninfp]

I was responding to Geof about England getting excomunnicated. Wasn't it Pope Urban who gave Ireland to King Henry II?

[Claverhouse]

I was responding to Geof about England getting excomunnicated. Wasn't it Pope Urban who gave Ireland to King Henry II?
Yeah, sorry Johnny's dad ( and one of the best damn kings any people ever had ): but it was Nicholas Breakspeare, the only English pope, and googling, I find he took the pontifical name of Hadrian IV. To be fair though he didn't give it because he was English, but because popes are willing to give any ruler anything they ask provided they support the papacy: the Borgia pope gave the whole New World to Spain and Portugal, and not because he was a Spaniard...

Also there was the fact that not only did the papacy ( rightly ) consider my ancestors savages, but that the Roman church never had that much love or charity to the rival doctrines and disciplines of the Celtic catholic church: in the context of the 12th century, giving over Ireland to England meant ensuring the triumph of the Roman model forever. Or until the secularist triumph in Ireland of the 1990s.


Claverhouse :ph34r:

[CoHo]

http://stirlbot.pragmatic.ca/pope.jpg
http://biblia.com/jesusbible/jewish-menorah-5.gif
http://www.skipressworld.com/images/daily_news/2003/12/ski%20press%20-%20santa.jpg
http://www.displaycostume.com/products/italy.jpg

[ohnoaninfp]

Ok?????????

[Geoff]

We English have been excommunicated a few times.

Henry II, John and Elizabeth I I believe. We rock :)

Oh, and Ohnoaninfp how do you think the Pope is going to help in Northern Ireland? Surely the answer is less religious overtones not more. We need to encourage less catholic v protestant arguments not more!

-Geoff

[Geoff]

Oh and by way of amusement value, the English were able to get the Irish excommunicated for opposing them. So that just adds to the fun.


"Through a generous attitude to enemies and a consolidation of feudal privileges, King Edward II managed to increase his influence among the Anglo-Irish. A royal mission to the Pope had also brought benefits. Archiepiscopal vacancies in Ireland were filled by men favourable to king Edward of England and all supporters of both Bruces were excommunicated. It appeared that Edward II was far more astute at politics than warfare."

[ohnoaninfp]

Geoff, the new pope could settle the troubles up north peacefully. Maybe he could help heal the wounds and get the Catholicss and Protestants to stop killing each other in the name of Christ.

[Birdsnest]

Well, they've chosen the new Pope. He's from Germany, "Joseph Rad__ something. I sit next to a Catholic girl, and she is so excited about it and said We have OUR NEW POPE!
http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/ww/beta/news/0418nm1.jpg (http://www.yahoo.com/_ylh=X3oDMTExNmQ4ZTZzBF9TAzI3MTYxNDkEdGVzdAN2MjI5BHRtcGwDdjIyOS1pZQ--/s/236963) New pope elected (http://www.yahoo.com/_ylh=X3oDMTExNmQ4ZTZzBF9TAzI3MTYxNDkEdGVzdAN2MjI5BHRtcGwDdjIyOS1pZQ--/s/236963)
Cardinal Ratzinger of Germany elected Pope Benedict XVI.

[coffeezombie]

Claverhouse gets the prize as he was the only person who predicted the winning country. Good job, Clave.

[crule81]

RATZINGER WILL BE THE NEXT POPE. I GUARANTEE IT.

Claverhouse wasn't the only one!

;P ;P ;P

[coffeezombie]

Claverhouse wasn't the only one!

;P ;P ;P

You voted for Italy up there. You must have changed your mind once you heard all the political rumors, or perhaps you thought Ratzinger was an Italian name.

[ApeTheDog]

I always suspected Radzinger had a good shot at being the next pope too. I brilliantly deduced this theory from media fragments I read everywhere in which they predicted that Radzinger had a good shot at becoming the next pope.

[crule81]

You voted for Italy up there. You must have changed your mind once you heard all the political rumors, or perhaps you thought Ratzinger was an Italian name.

Hah! You caught me! I didn't even realize it was a public pole. I also went back and edited my previous post (I'm evil today, heh.). I did mention Ratzinger originally, but thought the Italians would make a big push to get the papacy back. Our new pope is a former member of the Hitler Youth and was drafted into an anti-aircraft battery during the war. While he was very young at the time and one cannot reasonably hold it against him because: 1. He was German, 2. he was forced into the Hitler Youth, and 3. he was drafted into the service. It is funny that a Pope who resisted the Nazis will be replaced by one who served them (albeit not willfully).

[ohnoaninfp]

What prize did he win?

[crule81]

The thing that disturbs me is that Ratzinger's own countymen don't like him. Stark contrast from John Paul II, who was loved by the Poles. A lot of people I've spoken with so far do not like like him at all. Some merely because he is German and others because he is more conservative than was John Paul II.