INTPs and the quarterlife crisis?

[altblue]

Hi everyone, I'm new to this forum, just entered this crazy MTBI obsession ever since I read Paul James' disturbingly accurate portrait of me as an INTP. Particularly interesting was how he mentioned music and photography as typical interests, which are truly great interests of mine.

Anyway, I've been going through this kind of quarterlife crisis (or 20-something crisis, whatever you call it), and was wondering if any other INTPs out there could help or share their views.

I, like many INTPs here it seems, double-majored in Economics and Psychology in college because those were the 2 subjects that I liked the most, although I was also interested in Poli Sci and Sociology. I graduated about 2 years ago and am now working in my first real full-time job. The job is very laid-back and flexible, but has a lot of downtime and doesn't require too much mental stimulation. Now I've been really thinking a lot about what I really want to do with my life, career, etc., and it's just mind-boggling. I want to be consistently challenged, doing something new, etc. I get bored easily when I feel like I have something fully figured out, and I am very restless. Sometimes if I feel like I've been doing something for a long time that isn't satisfying or if I've been in a place that doesn't offer any new stimuli, I dream about drastic change, like quitting or moving or doing something totally different. My practical side tells me that's a bad idea and I've got to have a good plan about what exactly I want for a career and work towards it. But I just don't know what I want to do. I love music, traveling, photography, but I can't exactly convert those into immediately practical careers. I've been reading a bit here and there about INTPs on the net, and it seems as if many INTPs have suggested or hinted that few careers would satisfy us and we should just treat our jobs as jobs and do what we want on our free time. But I also really believe that I should like my job, and want to get up every day in the morning to go there. I feel like my mind is slowly decaying. I thought about getting a masters in International economics in Stockholm School of Economics, but then I don't think it will be really useful in the job market, plus I don't actually have the money to do that. Now I've been thinking about accounting, but I feel like it would be boring...I'm at a crossroads and I have no idea what to do. Any ideas, suggestions, similar experiences?? Would really appreciate any comments! :)

[Rajah]

Any ideas, suggestions, similar experiences?? Would really appreciate any comments! :)I really wish I could tell you what to do. I just wanted to let you know I'm in a similar boat.

All I can do is warn you not to use school as an escape route. You could be like me -- with a law degree, $150K in student loan debt, and still have profound doubts. If you want to try out a different career, go for it. But before you head back to school, make 197% sure it's something you really want -- and really need.

[eyebyte_atWork]

Most of us are in this boat - the closest thing I can think of is independent research (like towards a grad degree - but not neccessarely a degree bearing pursuit).

[Nighthawk]

Welcome to the club. I'm still in the same boat at age 43. In my first career, I had the luxury of changing positions every 12-18 months. The environment (military) sucked, but at least I was doing different things all the time. I made a career change at age 30 (computer science) and have jumped around many different jobs in that field. The ones I enjoyed most were research jobs in grad school ... but the pay was abysmal. My coping mechanism has been to jump around a lot to different jobs within a field. My current field is somewhat burnt out right now, as I have done just about everything that is commonplace. The more interesting jobs now are either scarce or don't pay much ... and unfortunately, I am addicted to my paycheck. For INTPs, I think the choice often boils down to getting a good paycheck vs. doing something interesting. Hustler has some alternate viewpoints on this which you can probably get him to elaborate.

[kendoiwan]

. Hustler has some alternate viewpoints on this which you can probably get him to elaborate.

:rofl: :rofl:
Fat chance... can't even get him to elaborate on who truly runs the yakuza and it was him who brought it up...

[Nighthawk]

http://forums.intpcentral.com/images/smilies/rofl1.gif http://forums.intpcentral.com/images/smilies/rofl1.gif
Fat chance... can't even get him to elaborate on who truly runs the yakuza and it was him who brought it up...Tongue in cheek http://forums.intpcentral.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[eyebyte_atWork]

I really wish I could tell you what to do. I just wanted to let you know I'm in a similar boat.

All I can do is warn you not to use school as an escape route. You could be like me -- with a law degree, $150K in student loan debt, and still have profound doubts. If you want to try out a different career, go for it. But before you head back to school, make 197% sure it's something you really want -- and really need.

Good warning - I was thinking about going back - getting my PHD and teach at the collegiate level.

I too racked up too much in loans - sux ass.

[altblue]

Yeah, isn't it sad how you have to choose between money or interest?? It's a constant battle within me....

[Ivy]

Yeah, isn't it sad how you have to choose between money or interest?? It's a constant battle within me....

And not only an INTP battle. I would love to be a "professional student" (aka dilletante, I guess) but money don't grow on trees. :) Plus, I would feel funny going for higher degrees when my husband has yet to earn a bachelor's.

My INTP husband, for various reasons, never went to college at all despite tremendous aptitude for math and science (and aptitude not to be sneezed at in the liberal arts, as well). He's an MCSE now but we're working on getting him to college, as soon as he figures out what to be when he grows up. :) He only got into computer networking because it was easy for him and could support a family-- I doubt he would choose computer science, since he has done it already. My suspicion is that he will study meteorology.

[abathur]

You might consider staying put, but plotting something. Decide what you might want to do on your own (as in, not with a company)--music, photography etc. would lend themselves well to this. Use your spare time to "dabble" until you can determine that it's really interesting enough (and to make sure you're somewhat capable) and then work on making some part-time cash. If work has downtime or is boring, use that time to plan or otherwise plot out what you'd like to do.

I like to be challenged, but I found a low-thought job where I could do a good bit of thinking on whatever I desired was gratifying. It felt more like someone was paying me to sit around and think than me actually trading in some of my precious thinking time for a paycheck. Perhaps working as a part-time photographer would end up being sufficient to keep you happy, but should you reach the point where you can't take the work anymore, you'll already have something developed for you to step into.

Not that I know anything--that's just what I would do ;)

[eyebyte_atWork]

Yeah - thats pretty bad - You almost have my situation pegged. almost

[Nighthawk]

Believe me, there are worse things out there then having your mind rotted out doing a boring job. Like (for example) Being in a lot of debt and married with children to support and thus working two jobs that are both rotting out your mind and leave you no time to do anything you enjoy.Thanks ... you made my day. Suddenly my one, mind-rotting, boring job doesn't seem so bad anymore.

[Hustler]

Any ideas, suggestions, similar experiences?? Would really appreciate any comments! :)

I doubt you will be legitimately content in any traditional job setting, no matter how much education you get first. If you want to get further education, make sure it is something you really want to do for its own sake, not something that you think will serve as the key to a satisfying career path because, in all likelihood, it will not.

I suggest making an attempt at a jobless lifestyle. It has worked well for me. The specifics are unimportant; what is important is that you earn money on your own terms. Perhaps this means something entrepreneurial or perhaps this means filling some undisclosed niche. Whatever the case, you will be more satisfied with your life if you answer to no one and make your own decisions. Start thinking about how to do that instead of how to get onto a more satisfying career path, and maybe you will stumble upon something rewarding.

Too bad you're not an INTJ, or I might just have the solution to your problem :P Oh well!

[Rajah]

Believe me, there are worse things out there then having your mind rotted out doing a boring job. Like (for example) Being in a lot of debt and married with children to support and thus working two jobs that are both rotting out your mind and leave you no time to do anything you enjoy.I'm in the same situation, except my one job takes up the time of two.

[Rajah]

Good warning - I was thinking about going back - getting my PHD and teach at the collegiate level.

I too racked up too much in loans - sux ass.I've been having those thoughts again too. It's amazing how I can rationalize it. "Yes, I have too much in debt and will be making nothing, but at least I can defer my loans again and sign up for income-sensitive repayment plans..."

Sigh.

[eyebyte_atWork]

Too bad you're not an INTJ, or I might just have the solution to your problem :P Oh well!

I'd like to hear it.

[PenguinHunter]

Oooops I wasn't extreme enough.

You could be mired in debt and married with kids and working two jobs that rot your brain with no time to do anything you enjoy, AND your wife wants a divorse so that she can keep the house but only have to watch the kids part of the time so that the pool boy can stay over 2 weekends a month, while you have to get a third job that rots your brain to afford a 1 bedroom apartment to move into becuase the first 2 jobs only cover your alamony and child support payments. AND some divorsed woman with 4 kids is stalking you because she sees you as a potential meal ticket because you work so hard.

seriously unsweet... I'm hoping that was you just making up a very bad scenario to make others feel better but I kind of doubt it... there were too many details...uhmm.. good luck?

[eyebyte_atWork]

I am divorced - though I have only one job - and no one woman - married, single, or divorce stalks me. (I was happy about that last one until recently)

[Hustler]

I'd like to hear it.

I posted a recruitment statement on N-Central and got zero response. I don't think you meet the requirements.

[eyebyte_atWork]

lol - too funny. story of my life.

[Hustler]

lol - too funny. story of my life.

At least you're an INTJ. Us INTPs have it worse than you when it comes to attaining satisfaction in our careers and other life endeavors.

[floyd]

Oooops I wasn't extreme enough.

You could be mired in debt and married with kids and working two jobs that rot your brain with no time to do anything you enjoy, AND your wife wants a divorse so that she can keep the house but only have to watch the kids part of the time so that the pool boy can stay over 2 weekends a month, while you have to get a third job that rots your brain to afford a 1 bedroom apartment to move into becuase the first 2 jobs only cover your alamony and child support payments. AND some divorsed woman with 4 kids is stalking you because she sees you as a potential meal ticket because you work so hard.

brilliant, i want to see this movie.

[Architectonic]

I posted a recruitment statement on N-Central and got zero response. I don't think you meet the requirements.

If you don't tell us what you actually do, we will all continue to assume you are full of shit.

[PsiKik]

But I also really believe that I should like my job, and want to get up every day in the morning to go there. I feel like my mind is slowly decaying.
I can identify with this 100%
I have been doing the same job(software design/programming) for the last 2 1/2 years and am starting to hate it. The exact same thing everyday, no challenge or chance to learn.
I am in shit at the moment because I could not motivate myself to work on this current project and am behind schedule. I wish I could have ajob I would wake up to in the morning and want to rush to.
I am addicted to the salary at the end of the month. I am terrified of losing it because my #1 fear is being homeless. I would quit if I knew I could go to something else, but what?

This whole issue of jobs/careers is a central one for INTPs. I think there should be a separate forum group where this could be discussed and possible solutions to this problem presented.

[sbw]

... and unfortunately, I am addicted to my paycheck. For INTPs, I think the choice often boils down to getting a good paycheck vs. doing something interesting. Hustler has some alternate viewpoints on this which you can probably get him to elaborate.

this is an unfortunate choice; I believe the best strategy is to use the former (temporarily) as a means to the latter. hustler does seem to have a good outlook with regards to the work/money/freedom paradigm, but doesn't seem to elaborate much (as kendoiwan pointed out).

I've not read the whole thread yet, but here's what I think (and I'll be 25 in 2 weeks): skip college, because it's 5 years of not making money even if you don't go into debt, which you will; get some kind of job--the more money the better, but almost anything will do (don't overlook the service industry, depending upon where you live); don't have kids, which will allow you to SAVE and INVEST some of your money from your job.

these steps should allow you to accumulate a positive net worth (even if it ain't much) with zero revolving debt within 5-10 years, tops. from there, you can pretty much do whatever you want. 'retired' at 30 or 35 is what we should all be working towards, thus creating limitless time for random intellectual pursuits (or video games). hope this helps.

Scott

[sbw]

seriously unsweet... I'm hoping that was you just making up a very bad scenario to make others feel better but I kind of doubt it... there were too many details...uhmm.. good luck?

yeah...I hope that's not real...we could make a REALLY funny movie out of it, though.

Scott

[Hustler]

If you don't tell us what you actually do, we will all continue to assume you are full of shit.

I think it is a bit risky for you to speak for everyone on this one. Not everyone is as small-minded as you.

[Architectonic]

I think it is a bit risky for you to speak for everyone on this one. Not everyone is as small-minded as you.

:sobs:

Surely you could have come up with a better retort than that.






Everyone except for naive 21+ female INTJs..... :whistle:

[Hustler]

Surely you could have come up with a better retort than that.

I could have, but I'm addressing the lowest common denominator here.

[Nighthawk]

I can identify with this 100%
I have been doing the same job(software design/programming) for the last 2 1/2 years and am starting to hate it. The exact same thing everyday, no challenge or chance to learn.10+ years of software design/programming here. I'm just going through the motions nowadays. I've had some interesting times, particularly at the beginning ... a few things that got patents (for my employer, of course) and some really cool work with DNA sequencing. Now its just mostly the same old crap ... financial software that pulls numbers out of a database and displays them in some sort of grid or form. The financial software business pays better than some of the more interesting areas, like bio-informatics and games ... so I'm stuck in the doldrums if I want to make decent money. Even so ... its still not too bad a solution. I have a fair amount of time to pursue things that I want to do, since they don't work me too hard. Now if I just wasn't so damned lazy.

[Nighthawk]

I posted a recruitment statement on N-Central and got zero response. I don't think you meet the requirements.Feel free to post it here. I've always been intrigued by the possible solutions you've found.

[MacGuffin]

He wants INTJs.

[kendoiwan]

Seeing as he hasn't found any takers he should start to consider intp's with highly developed J functions and applicable experience... :whistle:

[Nighthawk]

this is an unfortunate choice; I believe the best strategy is to use the former (temporarily) as a means to the latter. hustler does seem to have a good outlook with regards to the work/money/freedom paradigm, but doesn't seem to elaborate much (as kendoiwan pointed out).
I've done that a couple of times in the past ... used my present income to support myself with an eye towards personal endeavors. Started a few of my own business ventures ... but I found that customers are usually even more demanding and stupid than bosses. Plus, the money I earned being self-employed was usually a fraction of what I made as a software engineer ... for many more hours of actual work. I don't know ... maybe I never hit the right niche. That's why I'm interested in Hustler giving some examples. Maybe it's a matter of getting people to work for you ... in which case I am sunk, because I loathe managing people.



I've not read the whole thread yet, but here's what I think (and I'll be 25 in 2 weeks): skip college, because it's 5 years of not making money even if you don't go into debt, which you will; get some kind of job--the more money the better, but almost anything will do (don't overlook the service industry, depending upon where you live); don't have kids, which will allow you to SAVE and INVEST some of your money from your job.
Yes, that's for sure. I'd also caution to be very careful as to who you marry ... or if you marry at all. I've had kids and been through two divorces. That has literally chewed up hundreds of thousands of dollars. I've got zero revolving debt, but family still tends to drain a lot of resources. I'm still not at the point where I can do whatever I want, particularly as my standard of living tends to increase.

[Nighthawk]

He wants INTJs.
I've been socialized into an INTJ by the military ... does that count? ;)

[cjs55]

He wants an INTJ woman.

[Nighthawk]

He wants an INTJ woman.
Now my interest is really piqued.

[sbw]

Seeing as he hasn't found any takers he should start to consider intp's with highly developed J functions and applicable experience... :whistle:

*raises hand*

Scott

[nottaprettygal]

He wants an INTJ woman.

I'm all ears.

I don't do anal though.

[Dumpy]

Hi everyone, I'm new to this forum, just entered this crazy MTBI obsession ever since I read Paul James' disturbingly accurate portrait of me as an INTP.

could you paraphrase/quote this?

[melancholeric]

could you paraphrase/quote this?
? There's a link "INTP profile (http://intpcentral.com/?mode=profile) at the top of the page, 4th link from the left. Also available at http://intp.org/intprofile.html (which might be easier to read; different font etc... ) . And I thought everyone had read that.

[Madrigal]

I posted a recruitment statement on N-Central and got zero response. I don't think you meet the requirements.

I can be your INTJ. If you want me to.

[eyebyte_atWork]

I can be your INTJ. If you want me to.

Me? were you talking to me?

[Madrigal]

Me? were you talking to me?

Lol, I wasn't, I was just teasing Hustler, though I imagine you don't need another INTJ, do you? :)

[eyebyte_atWork]

Lol, I wasn't, I was just teasing Hustler, though I imagine you don't need another INTJ, do you? :)

My response actually came about as I remembered how my nephew is allways confirming to whom the grownups speak to.

I always hear the words "Me grandma? you mean me?"

I though it would be cute.

[Madrigal]

My response actually came about as I remembered how my nephew is allways confirming to whom the grownups speak to.

I always hear the words "Me grandma? you mean me?"

I though it would be cute.

Aww, narcissism is the cutest thing. :)

[Master O]

I posted a recruitment statement on N-Central and got zero response. I don't think you meet the requirements.
post it here. i more than anything want to get out of the 'workforce'. i want to work for myself and answer to no one. if it involves creative thinking, it already sounds good.

[PenguinHunter]

post it here. i more than anything want to get out of the 'workforce'. i want to work for myself and answer to no one. if it involves creative thinking, it already sounds good.

I can feel your hate growing.... be careful of the dark side and its teachers.

[eyebyte_atWork]

I can feel your hate growing.... be careful of the dark side and its teachers.

I disagree - he should give into his feelings - the dark side is a path to many things many would consider... unnatural. Like independence.

[PenguinHunter]

I disagree - he should give into his feelings - the dark side is a path to many things many would consider... unnatural. Like independence.

Hehe, I can imagine the Darth Vader saying that with a loud exhale at each break. I just think you should be careful of the reasons you choose "independence." If you just do it because you hate what you are doing now things may not work out so well. You can still get to independence by wanting it above other things rather than hating everything else. Otherwise... you become a slave to the very thing that you thought set you free... your hate...

:duel:

[eyebyte_atWork]

Hehe, I can imagine the Darth Vader saying that with a loud exhale at each break. I just think you should be careful of the reasons you choose "independence." If you just do it because you hate what you are doing now things may not work out so well. You can still get to independence by wanting it above other things rather than hating everything else. Otherwise... you become a slave to the very thing that you thought set you free... your hate...

:duel:

Not darth vader - the emporer - but what I was getting to , and by the way I do agree with your cautious message, that you can build a certain amount of independence AND do something that appeals to one's creative side. For people like me it is a bit harder as I have become accustomed to my paycheck - but it can be done non-the-less. I was invisioning Architecture or Engineering (software does not count) as a career that offers a lot of autonomy (law is also good here). If one strives for independence these are good options - but as you have stated - they may not be the answer to what is bugging you... they may only temporarely put off the search for the solution.

[kendoiwan]

I guess I'm just plain ole utilitarian about this...Everythings a hustle... so whatever works has and always will be my motto... :ph34r: :ph34r: :ph34r:

[sbw]

I guess I'm just plain ole utilitarian about this...Everythings a hustle... so whatever works has and always will be my motto... :ph34r: :ph34r: :ph34r:

yep. the sooner you can figure out how to not have to work a traditional job, the better.

Scott

[kendoiwan]

Ask about me, nigga, ask about me, I'ma, I'ma hustla, I'ma, I'ma hustla homey...

[Master O]

Hehe, I can imagine the Darth Vader saying that with a loud exhale at each break. I just think you should be careful of the reasons you choose "independence." If you just do it because you hate what you are doing now things may not work out so well. You can still get to independence by wanting it above other things rather than hating everything else. Otherwise... you become a slave to the very thing that you thought set you free... your hate...

:duel:
Hey. I'm not a noob.
I've given the world and society much thought since i was a teen. The rules never made sense to me, yet were an ever pervasive part of my life. They are stifling and suffocating. When you work for someone else, you are dependent on them. Whether you face it or not, someone else is running your life and telling you what to care about. You think i give a shit if i'm 3 or 4 minutes late? NO! But they want you to and they make you at least go through the motions.

I NEED FREEDOM!!! WHEW! DON'T GET ME STARTED!

[Master O]

Not darth vader - the emporer - but what I was getting to , and by the way I do agree with your cautious message, that you can build a certain amount of independence AND do something that appeals to one's creative side. For people like me it is a bit harder as I have become accustomed to my paycheck - but it can be done non-the-less. I was invisioning Architecture or Engineering (software does not count) as a career that offers a lot of autonomy (law is also good here). If one strives for independence these are good options - but as you have stated - they may not be the answer to what is bugging you... they may only temporarely put off the search for the solution.
Architecture will not make you wealthy. Within the technical fields, they are among the lowest paid for professionals. Also, until you have quite a bit of experience, you won't really be designing, but actually working on a specific little piece of someone else's design.

True freedom I believe comes with real estate and other forms of investment. Your money should be growing whether your driving around or sleeping in bed. As soon as I dig myself out of the debt that boredom built, I will begin to invest.

I have friends in the real estate industry. As soon as I'm ready, they will throw me a lifeline.

[Nighthawk]

I have friends in the real estate industry. As soon as I'm ready, they will throw me a lifeline.
I wish I had your friends. The only thing I've made in real-estate is an ulcer.

[eyebyte_atWork]

Architecture will not make you wealthy. Within the technical fields, they are among the lowest paid for professionals. Also, until you have quite a bit of experience, you won't really be designing, but actually working on a specific little piece of someone else's design.

True freedom I believe comes with real estate and other forms of investment. Your money should be growing whether your driving around or sleeping in bed. As soon as I dig myself out of the debt that boredom built, I will begin to invest.

I have friends in the real estate industry. As soon as I'm ready, they will throw me a lifeline.

Every thing you have stated is true - I was on the path to structural Engineering - that was going to lead to good profits as once you're licensed you can be a free agent. You will most likely have to work for someone else until you get a reputation - but you could also do general contracting as you would already know the good builders around (I am not talking about homes - but bigger things like office buildings). Killing two birds with one stone - contracting - and design. Also I would also invest into the building and supply companies - like concrete companies that I knew were good at what they do and I knew got good contract work. THat was my idea of it - not just plain work. Besides - real estate involves sales - and as for me - I think I would not like selling one bit. If you can sell - then absolutely real estate is great - now if you are talking about real estate development - back to civil engineering - they have the best contacts along with the tax appraisors. It is a screwed up world as appraisors are mainly SJ types.

and I have tried day trading - and investing - good stuff but not for the faint of heart. Also - be willing to lose it all because - as life has shown me - you will every now and then. I do agree with what you have said about money working for you whether you're in a coma or not - I have known that since I was 13 - I am now 33. It is easier said than done. (ofcourse - I think everyone else can do this -except me)

[lexiphanic]

If I go back to school, I'm going to hit some kind of engineering, and hit it hard.

Desk job with benefits.

[eyebyte_atWork]

If I go back to school, I'm going to hit some kind of engineering, and hit it hard.

Desk job with benefits.

I hear you - real work sux.

You can sell - too much work
You can "Do" something - too much work

But Engineering - a good in between position - brain work - minimal crap work (for the money).

Engineering - hell yeah.

[lexiphanic]

And you occasionally have to go out to a site and supervise. Hence the benefits.

[eyebyte_atWork]

And you occasionally have to go out to a site and supervise. Hence the benefits.

While I was an intern many moons ago - me and my manager would go check out the field people and afterwards - go drinking beer and playing pool. There are perks.

[Master O]

Every thing you have stated is true - I was on the path to structural Engineering - that was going to lead to good profits as once you're licensed you can be a free agent. You will most likely have to work for someone else until you get a reputation - but you could also do general contracting as you would already know the good builders around (I am not talking about homes - but bigger things like office buildings). Killing two birds with one stone - contracting - and design. Also I would also invest into the building and supply companies - like concrete companies that I knew were good at what they do and I knew got good contract work. THat was my idea of it - not just plain work. Besides - real estate involves sales - and as for me - I think I would not like selling one bit. If you can sell - then absolutely real estate is great - now if you are talking about real estate development - back to civil engineering - they have the best contacts along with the tax appraisors. It is a screwed up world as appraisors are mainly SJ types.

and I have tried day trading - and investing - good stuff but not for the faint of heart. Also - be willing to lose it all because - as life has shown me - you will every now and then. I do agree with what you have said about money working for you whether you're in a coma or not - I have known that since I was 13 - I am now 33. It is easier said than done. (ofcourse - I think everyone else can do this -except me) I didn't mean being a real estate agent, I meant buying and turning over properties. I have a friend who is the the #1 agent for Coldwell Banker in my city. She will know how to handle all of the selling and she has great contacts.

To me it would be fun to go around doing research on properties and determining which will provide the greatest return. It requires foresight and creative thinking. I see a life for me where i'm not bored.

Also, if worse comes to worst, and the real estate doesn't work, I will teach golf. Not quite exciting, but free golf and not being confined to the indoors is appealing.

[eyebyte_atWork]

I didn't mean being a real estate agent, I meant buying and turning over properties. I have a friend who is the the #1 agent for Coldwell Banker in my city. She will know how to handle all of the selling and she has great contacts.

To me it would be fun to go around doing research on properties and determining which will provide the greatest return. It requires foresight and creative thinking. I see a life for me where i'm not bored.

Also, if worse comes to worst, and the real estate doesn't work, I will teach golf. Not quite exciting, but free golf and not being confined to the indoors is appealing.


Good plan - very good plan.

[Nighthawk]

I didn't mean being a real estate agent, I meant buying and turning over properties. I have a friend who is the the #1 agent for Coldwell Banker in my city. She will know how to handle all of the selling and she has great contacts.

To me it would be fun to go around doing research on properties and determining which will provide the greatest return. It requires foresight and creative thinking. I see a life for me where i'm not bored.

Also, if worse comes to worst, and the real estate doesn't work, I will teach golf. Not quite exciting, but free golf and not being confined to the indoors is appealing.
I've also found that a very appealing notion ... the real estate - I suck at golf. I haven't had much success with turning over properties however. For some reason, I don't have the instinct for it. It always turns out to be a never ending nightmare for me. I wish you the best of luck.

[PenguinHunter]

Not darth vader - the emporer -

haha, no offense intended of course, but I was thinking more of Hustler as the emporer in that scene. He subtly develops the hate in you while Darth states the motive and reasoning more openly. hmmm... the emporer must be an INTJ though.... what is Darth?

[sbw]

I didn't mean being a real estate agent, I meant buying and turning over properties. I have a friend who is the the #1 agent for Coldwell Banker in my city. She will know how to handle all of the selling and she has great contacts.

To me it would be fun to go around doing research on properties and determining which will provide the greatest return. It requires foresight and creative thinking. I see a life for me where i'm not bored.

Also, if worse comes to worst, and the real estate doesn't work, I will teach golf. Not quite exciting, but free golf and not being confined to the indoors is appealing.

it is a good gig (the real estate stuff). and you live in a good spot for speculating (that's all I'm doing). and living in a retirement zone, you will never run out of students, if you go that route.

Scott

[eyebyte_atWork]

haha, no offense intended of course, but I was thinking more of Hustler as the emporer in that scene. He subtly develops the hate in you while Darth states the motive and reasoning more openly. hmmm... the emporer must be an INTJ though.... what is Darth?

I always thought Darth was and ISTP whipped into servitude. He's sort of a hired gun.

[MacGuffin]

I always thought Darth was and ISTP whipped into servitude. He's sort of a hired gun.Me too.

[kendoiwan]

Me too.


Hmmm, the movie made him seem like a misguided ENFJ actually... :duel:

[Rajah]

I was invisioning Architecture or Engineering (software does not count) as a career that offers a lot of autonomy (law is also good here).Law? Autonomy? You're always a slave to the partners, senior associates with inflated senses of selves, and your clients.

[eyebyte_atWork]

Law? Autonomy? You're always a slave to the partners, senior associates with inflated senses of selves, and your clients.


OR

you can hang your shingle out and wait for customers - (yes - I know - you never wait for customers - you buye list - mail/email them - an work yo butt off)

You do not have to work for someone else - yes - you would be a better lawyer by working with others - but you do not have to.

[Rajah]

OR

you can hang your shingle out and wait for customers - (yes - I know - you never wait for customers - you buye list - mail/email them - an work yo butt off)

You do not have to work for someone else - yes - you would be a better lawyer by working with others - but you do not have to.That assumes that you can open a practice for yourself, which with my enormous student debt is impossible.

Plus, you're still a slave to your clients. I know a business owner, to some extent, is always a slave to his clients. However, I believe it's more pervasive in law. If I don't do something well for my client, it's not like he'll just elect to use a different firm - I'd be facing malpractice issues and could lose my license. I can't just tell a client to fuck off, no matter how much I want to.

[Nighthawk]

Plus, you're still a slave to your clients. I know a business owner, to some extent, is always a slave to his clients. However, I believe it's more pervasive in law. If I don't do something well for my client, it's not like he'll just elect to use a different firm - I'd be facing malpractice issues and could lose my license. I can't just tell a client to fuck off, no matter how much I want to.That's been my experience as well running my own business. Clients and customers are ten times more difficult/stupid than any boss I've had. Plus, the hours for my own business were much longer than what I have now as an employee. I've tried a few businesses and have not enjoyed "being my own boss" in any of them.

[eyebyte_atWork]

That assumes that you can open a practice for yourself, which with my enormous student debt is impossible.

Plus, you're still a slave to your clients. I know a business owner, to some extent, is always a slave to his clients. However, I believe it's more pervasive in law. If I don't do something well for my client, it's not like he'll just elect to use a different firm - I'd be facing malpractice issues and could lose my license. I can't just tell a client to fuck off, no matter how much I want to.

Yeah - you're in a tough spot.

But you can choose not to be (granted the fallout is probably more than you or I would want)

But in general - an attorney can work by him/herself. Thats what I was getting at. In reality even medical doctors end up working for someone else due to contributing factors. Engineers too.

[afton]

But I also really believe that I should like my job, and want to get up every day in the morning to go there. I feel like my mind is slowly decaying.
Yes me too, I feel that my precious neuron cells die each day, of disuse.

My ideal (at least atm) is to be a research scientist in a children medical
research institute.
Firstly, I like to help people, but I'm an introvert and I can't stand
talking for too long, I prefer to think alone, therefore stuff like social
work and counselling is definitely not for me.
Secondly I have an interest in biology. Being a research scientist seems to combine this two interests pretty well. Well, the job must be an analytical one, not a boring drudgework. To get that, I think I have to be the top 0.0001% student, but I don't mind to put in the hard work, if it's really that good.

Anyway, check this one out, this video really moved me:
http://www.cmri.com.au/video.php
I always question that immortal question of theodicy, why would a good
God allow evil in this world. Why would he allow children to be born
with terminal and incurable genetic illness. Although somehow it doesn't
make 100% logical sense, I believe what Jesus said in John 9:3
"but this happened so that the work of God might be displayed in his life".
Rather than keep questioning this futile question, I'd rather be doing
something to rectify it, and being a research scientist seems to be
a fulfilling job.

I believe like Victor Frankl said, you have to find a sense of purpose and
meaning in your life. 80% of our waking life consisted of work, so therefore
I agree very much, (if you can) - find the job that you love - whatever that is.