INTP/INFJ

[TempestWalk]

Hello. This could go in the intro thread, but it's a MBTI question also, so I think it would be better here.

About a week ago, I took an online version of the test, and came out as an INTJ. The profile was pretty inaccurate for me, but noticing my percentages in the T and J categories were pretty close to 0, I decided to read the various INXX profiles, and look for a match.

INFP was another miss, but both the INTP (http://www.personalitypage.com/INTP_rel.html)
and INFJ (http://www.geocities.com/lifexplore/infj.htm) profiles fit me pretty well. Obviously they're quite different types, but each was about 2/3 correct for me.

So, if you've associated with both INTPs and INFJs, are there any questions or options you could give me to help me figure out my type? Maybe ones that stray away from test questions such as, "Do you make decisions based on your feelings?" Because that really tends to depend on the decision being made, doesn't it? (For me, at any rate. Will that help with the typing any? :) )

[Nighthawk]

Are you more into "spiritual" self-discovery? ... or the quest for any kind of knowledge? The former would indicate INFJ, the latter INTP. INFJs are some of my favorite people ... then again, so are INTPs.

[TempestWalk]

Thanks for your help, Nighhawk. Nice to know I'm a favourite whichever way I fall.

Religion aside, I'm considering the spiritual self-discovery. I value knowledge, but if you offered me a path to one of the two, I'd most likely go for the first. So that's a point for INFJ. An important one, would you say?

[Nighthawk]

Thanks for your help, Nighhawk. Nice to know I'm a favourite whichever way I fall.

Religion aside, I'm considering the spiritual self-discovery. I value knowledge, but if you offered me a path to one of the two, I'd most likely go for the first. So that's a point for INFJ. An important one, would you say?The spiritual quest need not be religious. A good INFJ friend of mine (now deceased http://forums.intpcentral.com/images/smilies/sad.gif ) was very spiritual but not religious. She helped me through my mind funk after the first gulf war.

[kuranes]

The spiritual quest need not be religious. A good INFJ friend of mine (now deceased http://forums.intpcentral.com/images/smilies/sad.gif ) was very spiritual but not religious. She helped me through my mind funk after the first gulf war.

It would be interesting to hear more about her philosophies and teachings/therapies sometime NH. Perhaps it would be impossible to summarize them without diluting them to the point of becoming bromides, though. Or not.

[TPol]

I'm mostly INTP. My sister is INFJ. Logic rules my decisions. I simply do not trust my feelings when making decisions. If a path "feels" right, it must also be a logical route, too. In contrast, my sister trusts her feelings, even though the path she's about to choose doesn't seem logical to me. Sometimes, that serves her well, especially when the decision had to do with interacting with people or making a decision on their behalf. From what I've seen, she and several other "F's" see INTPs and INTJs as somewhat cold and distant, trusting our minds over our hearts most of the time.

She tends to be more sensitive and slightly inefficient in crisis, while my "cold logic" serves me quickly and efficiently to do the tasks that are needed. Yet, she introduces the much-needed "humor in the face of heartache" quite a bit better than I do. She seems much more free and quick with humorous remarks; whereas, I tend to think it over a little too much and "miss the moment."

She is far more judgemental of people and their actions than I am. I have a tendency to say, "let them live the way they want to live. No skin off my nose." She, on the other hand, will feel like they need to do something differently and will try to persuade them (usually through an emotional appeal) to do "what is for their own good."

If the person is doing something that affects me or someone I care about, I may try to persuade them away from the behavior....but 99% of the time, I will use logic in my persuasion tactics. I will be disgusted that the person didn't see the logic. She will be disgusted that the person didn't care enough to change. Yet, she'll try again and again and again in her persuasion. I have a tendency to say, "they aren't reasonable/logical. I'm going to have to manipulate their environment so that it leads them to a more logical path...or I'm going to involve the authorities."

I am project- or interest-oriented. She is people-oriented. We are both introverted, but I am more so. I don't care what people think of me, and that includes loved ones, to a big degree. She cares quite a lot about what people close to her think of her. She is a little too "this is the way you should be" for my taste. I am a little too "cold and uninvolved" for her taste.

Sometimes, I can judge what a person's type is by how they relate to people of which I know their type. Maybe get to know the types of some of the people around you, especially those with whom you have some conflicts. What they turn out to be may very well have an opposite letter to you. Those you relate best to ("Ah, I'm that way too!") may be the same letter as you on one of the MBTI slots. I'm going to quit now before I start making even less sense. ;)

[Nighthawk]

It would be interesting to hear more about her philosophies and teachings/therapies sometime NH. Perhaps it would be impossible to summarize them without diluting them to the point of becoming bromides, though. Or not.Well ... she was Polynesian and lived on the island of Kauai. Into a lot of the Eastern philosophies. The two that I remember were Reiki and Tai Chi. She was a Reiki Master (not sure what level) and believed that the flow of energy through and around the body had a lot to do with mental, physical, and spiritual well being. Not into material possessions. She was a very kind-hearted person and quite structured/organized with her J. She related well to people and did make value judgements most of the time as opposed to logic. We'd get into some serious abstract debates along the boundaries of logic and feeling. She also had a very passionate and sensual side that usually came out a night. Needed her alone time however, and would sometimes disappear for days to get it. She was a flight attendant, so had no problems hopping a plane to disappear for a while.

[Snowflake]

She, on the other hand, will feel like they need to do something differently and will try to persuade them (usually through an emotional appeal) to do "what is for their own good."

That is so absolutely annoying, it is absolutely mindboggling.

As far as I'm concerned, what is right for you is NOT right for everyone, so if you ever try to persuade me, you'll get what's coming :banned:

[Nighthawk]

She, on the other hand, will feel like they need to do something differently and will try to persuade them (usually through an emotional appeal) to do "what is for their own good."


That is so absolutely annoying, it is absolutely mindboggling.

As far as I'm concerned, what is right for you is NOT right for everyone, so if you ever try to persuade me, you'll get what's coming http://forums.intpcentral.com/images/smilies/banned.gifThis was a major point of contention between my INFJ girlfriend and me. Fortunately, she did not tell me what I "should" do very often ... but when she felt strongly about something ... whoo boy ... no letting up.

[nonsequitur]

I took notice of this topic because I too swing between INFJ and INTP.. Never INFP or INTJ (though I recently tested as INTJ). I am very close on both the F/T and P/J scales.


I'm mostly INTP. My sister is INFJ. Logic rules my decisions. I simply do not trust my feelings when making decisions. If a path "feels" right, it must also be a logical route, too. In contrast, my sister trusts her feelings, even though the path she's about to choose doesn't seem logical to me. Sometimes, that serves her well, especially when the decision had to do with interacting with people or making a decision on their behalf. From what I've seen, she and several other "F's" see INTPs and INTJs as somewhat cold and distant, trusting our minds over our hearts most of the time.

I find logical reasons to justify taking the path that "feels" right. Sometimes I take the path that feels right, sometimes I don't. It really depends on the situation, and what is at risk.


She tends to be more sensitive and slightly inefficient in crisis, while my "cold logic" serves me quickly and efficiently to do the tasks that are needed. Yet, she introduces the much-needed "humor in the face of heartache" quite a bit better than I do. She seems much more free and quick with humorous remarks; whereas, I tend to think it over a little too much and "miss the moment."

Again, it depends really on the crisis. There are some situations where I do the humour thing (usually where other people are concerned and are feeling bad), and some where I just flip into "let's follow logic" mode. I really am quite inconsistent.


She is far more judgemental of people and their actions than I am. I have a tendency to say, "let them live the way they want to live. No skin off my nose." She, on the other hand, will feel like they need to do something differently and will try to persuade them (usually through an emotional appeal) to do "what is for their own good."

I do feel that others should do things differently, for their own good. However, I try my best not to interfere with their lives, so it's a bit of both. I feel bad about not "guiding" the person, and then I decide that it's their life after all, I can't make their decisions for them. Afterward, I still don't feel good about it, though.


If the person is doing something that affects me or someone I care about, I may try to persuade them away from the behavior....but 99% of the time, I will use logic in my persuasion tactics. I will be disgusted that the person didn't see the logic. She will be disgusted that the person didn't care enough to change. Yet, she'll try again and again and again in her persuasion. I have a tendency to say, "they aren't reasonable/logical. I'm going to have to manipulate their environment so that it leads them to a more logical path...or I'm going to involve the authorities."

I tend to get disgusted at both the fact that the person didn't bother enough to change, and that he/she wasn't logical..


I am project- or interest-oriented. She is people-oriented. We are both introverted, but I am more so. I don't care what people think of me, and that includes loved ones, to a big degree. She cares quite a lot about what people close to her think of her. She is a little too "this is the way you should be" for my taste. I am a little too "cold and uninvolved" for her taste.

Heheh, again, elements of both. I find that a lot of what I do is people-oriented, and yet at the same time, I find good reasons in self-interest to do it. I swing between complete apathy (about what others think of me) to caring a lot, it's really either extreme and depends on the situation. If there's something that I believe firmly in, I will do it regardless of what my family thinks and feels. However, if I'm not really convinced either way, I'll pull out all stops to make everyone feel good.


Sometimes, I can judge what a person's type is by how they relate to people of which I know their type. Maybe get to know the types of some of the people around you, especially those with whom you have some conflicts. What they turn out to be may very well have an opposite letter to you. Those you relate best to ("Ah, I'm that way too!") may be the same letter as you on one of the MBTI slots. I'm going to quit now before I start making even less sense. ;)

I relate very well to both INTPs (the relatively sensitive ones) and INFJs (the more logical ones). Actually, I could get along with almost anyone, as long as they are not too extreme in their behavior.. In which case they'd just be psycho.

I still can't decide which type I am at this point either. (sorry about highjacking your thread, TempestWalk.)

[MaroonBells]

Hello. This could go in the intro thread, but it's a MBTI question also, so I think it would be better here.

About a week ago, I took an online version of the test, and came out as an INTJ. The profile was pretty inaccurate for me, but noticing my percentages in the T and J categories were pretty close to 0, I decided to read the various INXX profiles, and look for a match.

INFP was another miss, but both the INTP (http://www.personalitypage.com/INTP_rel.html)
and INFJ (http://www.geocities.com/lifexplore/infj.htm) profiles fit me pretty well. Obviously they're quite different types, but each was about 2/3 correct for me.

So, if you've associated with both INTPs and INFJs, are there any questions or options you could give me to help me figure out my type? Maybe ones that stray away from test questions such as, "Do you make decisions based on your feelings?" Because that really tends to depend on the decision being made, doesn't it? (For me, at any rate. Will that help with the typing any? :) )

someone described INTP's as soft on the outside/ hard on the inside while INFJ's are the other way around. my brother is an INFJ and this description fits our differences very well

[jyakulis]

INTP/INFJ=
INTP Ni=3/8 Fe=5/8 Ti=1 Se=2/8 Ne=7/8 Fi=1/8 Te=5/8 Si=6/8
INFJ Ni=1 Fe=7/8 Ti=6/8 Se=5/8 Ne=4/8 Fi=3/8 Te=2/8 Si=1/8

dividing functionally and adding the terms gives 13.031

there's your answer

[TempestWalk]

Thanks for helping, everyone. Especially that 13.031 post.

My conclusion, if you'd like to know, is that although I don't click with a lot of things in TPol's post, I've decided I am overall INFJ, tending to act INTP in uncomfortable situations. So I suppose you guys are sort of like my defense mechinism. :)

[INTrPosr]

Why are some of you continuing to mis-state NTs as thinkers and NFs as feelers, as though there is emotions involved. The principles are basic and clear, regarding this matter. MBTI and similar test are the results of cognition only. The difference is that F's take the human factor into consideration, whereas T's may not. However, this is not conclusive. I would think that INTJs and INTPs may consider the human factor, at least from an internal standpoint. Fi is the third type function for INTPs (depending on how you decipher all eight functions for a type).

As for this thread, I have always considered these two types too close to call for many. To determine whether one is your true type, it may be best to determine some other factors, i.e., your temperament (NT/NF), your interaction style (Behind The Scenes/Chart The Course). I would say enneagram and Oldham's style can help, however I am almost sure that INFJs can be 5w4s and idiosyncratic.

[Lucybee]

Not trying to generalize, but INFJs tend to be naturally more in touch with our feelings. Do you usually know what you are feeling?

If you are a feeling type, you are more likely to remember the way you felt when you look back on a specific situation. A thinker would be more likely to remember details such as the date and weather. :happpy:

Also, if you are an INFJ, then your thoughts are very organized, though you may not be neat with your possesions (the organization is in the inner-world, not outer).

An INFJ's inferior function is sensation. If you are very clumsy and hate sports with a passion, like me, this is a good indication.:lol:

If you feels that you can never be happy unless you are helping others, this also indicates that you are an INFJ. INTPs are not nearly as concerned about this.

You may also consider the issue of your anima. If you haven't already, you should try reading about the ESFJ and ESTP. Think about which one you are atracted to.

Hope this helps.:happpy:

[YHWH]

If you feels that you can never be happy unless you are helping others, this also indicates that you are an INFJ. INTPs are not nearly as concerned about this.


I feel awful and used when I help people, even -not so close- friends.
I'm not that incredibly selfish, it just seems to me people do it in order to gain affection, recognition and attention from others, there's weakness written all over this process - not to mention I hate affection and attention from random people.

[Daaf]

You'll be happy to know that I have found both personalities very accurate in describing myself, but when push comes to shove and I have to act on instinct I tend to behave far more INTP than anything else.

Also, the function breakdown will show you that
INTP :Ti Ne Si Fe
INFJ : Ni Fe Ti Se

Only functions not represented are Te - so I'm guessing you are not a very neat and tidy type of person and Fi so from time to time you might have made some morally questionable decisions...

I've found that unlike other INTPs I tend to care more about others (eventhough I don't always act on my feelings) also
unlike most INTPs I tend to care for my appearance quite a bit...

I am also very much interested in Psychology, finding my purpose, and sticking it to the man (a very INFJ trait, INTPs might fantasize over it though ;) )

[digesthisickness]

I feel awful and used when I help people, even -not so close- friends.
I'm not that incredibly selfish, it just seems to me people do it in order to gain affection, recognition and attention from others, there's weakness written all over this process - not to mention I hate affection and attention from random people.

nice user name.

[YHWH]

Cheers mate.

[Zero Angel]

LOL my thoughts too. You know, Jesus was an INFJ. :p

[YHWH]

Who's that ?

[Lucybee]

LOL my thoughts too. You know, Jesus was an INFJ. :p

Totally. :grin:


I feel awful and used when I help people, even -not so close- friends.
I'm not that incredibly selfish, it just seems to me people do it in order to gain affection, recognition and attention from others, there's weakness written all over this process - not to mention I hate affection and attention from random people.

Sorry, I didn't mean to make it sound like INTPs are all selfish. And while you are correct in that many people do "help" others for attention and such, that's not everyone.

[GracefulJourney]

Can I hijack your post too?

I'm pretty sure I'm INTP at this stage, while before I keep my own type as INXX. But I figure out a several reasons that people may type me as a F, so as to provide something on how to differentiate when people are all on the T<->F continuum.

People type me as F because I have feeling. Everyone has feeling. Who does not? The point is how to deal with the feeling right?

And the point is really rask- / project-orientated or people-orientated. I think this is good enough. I hate the social interactions in a project. If I am to do a group project with the others, please just get to the point and make the job done, I don't want to know how are you doing with your boyfriend... That's it! I reckon most F people won't react too strongly like me, because judging from the facial expression of my group mates, I must have put on an are-you-retarded? expression on my face. Guess F will never do this. Any F verify this?

[Lucybee]

People type me as F because I have feeling. Everyone has feeling. Who does not? The point is how to deal with the feeling right?

Yes. Anyone can use logical analysis, and anyone can have strong feelings. The difference is how much weight you put on them, how you prefer to make decisions.

[YHWH]

Totally. :grin:

No way in hell, a guy who spends his day every day parading in the hood with 12 other young men and a couple young womenz washing his feet preaching to the crowd and performing fishy magic tricks can't be introverted.


Sorry, I didn't mean to make it sound like INTPs are all selfish. And while you are correct in that many people do "help" others for attention and such, that's not everyone.

Didn't think that's what you meant. But whenever I help people, at the end of the day I feel awful, as if I did something immoral or plain bad and evil.

Someone tell me that's an INTP trait cause I don't know what the fuck that is.

[edge walker]

No way in hell, a guy who spends his day every day parading in the hood with 12 other young men and a couple young womenz washing his feet preaching to the crowd and performing fishy magic tricks can't be introverted.
He's generally considered ENFJ.

(And whaddayaknow, one of the ENFJ stereotypes is "the cult leader"...)

[Toonia]

INTP (http://www.personalitypage.com/INTP_rel.html)
and INFJ (http://www.geocities.com/lifexplore/infj.htm) profiles fit me pretty well.

The types are described a little differently on each site and each MBTI book it seems, but those two descriptions in particular do have an interesting overlap especially in terms of having a preference for dealing with abstract concepts, a strong drive to learn and form an internal structure of thought that is coherent. The deciding factor between those two descriptions is the way the individual interacts with human emotion, the internal perceptions and experiences of others which cannot be measured or proven absolutely.

[Lucybee]

No way in hell, a guy who spends his day every day parading in the hood with 12 other young men and a couple young womenz washing his feet preaching to the crowd and performing fishy magic tricks can't be introverted.

No, seriously! INFJs are the introverts that push past our comfort zones to help others. And Jesus needed to go into the wilderness periodically to be alone and pray. He was re-charging, like any introvert needs to do (imho).

[Toonia]

No way in hell, a guy who spends his day every day parading in the hood with 12 other young men and a couple young womenz washing his feet preaching to the crowd and performing fishy magic tricks can't be introverted.
I can't really respond to most of this, but I do some of my own fishy magic tricks, and I am introverted, but then again the whole world doesn't exactly know about it.

[A Schnitzel]

I can't really respond to most of this, but I do some of my own fishy magic tricks, and I am introverted, but then again the whole world doesn't exactly know about it.

Get one of your disciples to write a book. Then you'd be gold.