Is it too late to for IT?

[aether]

I was wondering if it's still possible to make a career switch to IT. I have no technical background but am comfortable with computers/systems. Liberal arts major though.

Can I still get my foot in the door with certifications, A+ etc?? Any thoughts?
I will hail to you. :worthy:

[Rhu]

I guess the first question is: Are you still in school? If so, what year?

[aether]

I guess the first question is: Are you still in school? If so, what year?

Actually no, I graduated two years ago. I have had jobs not suitable for INTP's since graduating. Insurance adjuster and Legal Assistant, unfortunately. I am trying to do something close to suitable for an INTP such as attorney or computers, hence the IT question.

:worthy:

[dziner]

Did you consider technical writing? That is one area saught by liberal arts majors. Though it is not suitable for INTP, it can just prove to be an entry door to IT.

I am doing this even if I had a technical background (not CS). I am trying to switch to programming.

You can also consider certifications like RHCE or MCSE to get into system administration.

[DevRock]

If you have no experience, it's going to be difficult. I'd see if you could get a few IT internships. You probably won't get paid, but you'll get the experience you need. Don't bother trying to get any certifications (MSCE, etc). They're a waste of time and money and do nothing in terms of real world, OTJ experience.
Good luck!

[Nighthawk]

I made the switch to IT at age 31, when I has been out of college about 10 years. I did it by going back to school for a masters in computer science. I was able to get a job above entry level after I graduated ... given that I had an advanced degree (for what it was worth) and some leadership experience.

[kuranes]

Did you consider technical writing? That is one area saught by liberal arts majors. Though it is not suitable for INTP, it can just prove to be an entry door to IT.

I am doing this even if I had a technical background (not CS). I am trying to switch to programming.

You can also consider certifications like RHCE or MCSE to get into system administration.

How do you get your foot in the door in Tech Writing? Seems they always want "experience." I can't afford to work for free just to get that.

[eyebyte_atWork]

To break into it - as a career change is not all that difficult - but it does take sacrifice.

1. Learn about what part of IT you want to get into... then apply for entry level openings (or openings that may allow you soem hands on)

2. You may have to do some other work and perform IT stuff as a secondary function - then apply for another job citing the current position as experience - again entry level

3. Keep repeating the above; all the while aquiring more skills - every now and then asking for higher salary.

4. YOu may have to live on scraps for a while - but you can eventually get there - many others have.



MOst of all - you can start now - in your current job... example - create a database system that tracks something - whatever needs tracking at work - like orders - or work needing to be done - anything - and show how your input will help (you'll most likely have to do this for free).

[Nadiar]

If you have no experience, it's going to be difficult. I'd see if you could get a few IT internships. You probably won't get paid, but you'll get the experience you need. Don't bother trying to get any certifications (MSCE, etc). They're a waste of time and money and do nothing in terms of real world, OTJ experience.
Good luck!
I don't know where you're working that they don't care about certifications at all... You can learn a lot while studying for a Certification.

Its important to realize that there are different 'levels' of Certification depending on what you're doing.

In Networking, I like to use normal schooling to equate what they're worth:
A+ = GDE
Networking+ = High School
CCNA = Associates Degree
CCNP = Bachelors Degree
CCIE = PhD

For this area at least, a Certification alone will always be trumped by equivelent level schooling, but Experience + Certification will always trump schooling.

[DevRock]

I don't know where you're working that they don't care about certifications at all... You can learn a lot while studying for a Certification.

Its important to realize that there are different 'levels' of Certification depending on what you're doing.

In Networking, I like to use normal schooling to equate what they're worth:
A+ = GDE
Networking+ = High School
CCNA = Associates Degree
CCNP = Bachelors Degree
CCIE = PhD

For this area at least, a Certification alone will always be trumped by equivelent level schooling, but Experience + Certification will always trump schooling.


I've worked in a couple of places that didn't care at all about certifications, large and small companies. Real world experience trumps all.
A buddy of mine had a bunch of CISCO certifications and it didn't do squat for him. Why? Because he didn't have any experience (with CISCO networking - he's a genius at regular networking, support, server maint, etc.). He just let them all expire. He wasted hundreds of hours studying and thousands in testing fees.

If the certification happens while you're working somewhere (and your employer will actually pay for it, which mine have NEVER done) it can certainly help. But, starting out, most employers care more that you have actually maintained a business network, built a database, etc. than if you aced your MCSE exam.

[eyebyte_atWork]

Real world experience trumps all.



Word.

[dziner]

How do you get your foot in the door in Tech Writing? Seems they always want "experience." I can't afford to work for free just to get that.

I had an engineering background and I was lucky enough to get hired as a trainee by a mechanical engineering software firm :) .

[Nadiar]

Unless you never change jobs, I'd like to see you get the work you deserve based on experience alone.

[jread]

The difficulty of switching to IT from another field has basically made me give up on the idea. I looked at getting an MS in Computer Science, but the background requirements to enter the program require 40 hours of undergraduate courses. 40 hours!!! I'm not going to finish my bachelor's degree, go back for 40 more hours of undergrad work and then enter the graduate program. That's ridiculous. I could get two master's degrees in other fields in the same amount of time.

My main interest in IT is programming, so I guess I'll do some learning on my own and take training classes when I can. I'm registered for a two-day training session in "python" next week, so we'll see how it goes. If I decide I like programming enough then maybe I'll get more serious about it. As it stands now, though, I'm wanting to go into urban planning which is pretty non-technical.

[akirafist]

Get your MBA and go into IT managment. The MBA degree requirements are easy (compared to MS in CSE), and you can do most of it online.

Best of all, you can do like Eyebyte and Nighthawk's manager and go home at 4pm sharp while demanding your employees work overtime.

'Tis the life.

[tinribz]

Get your MBA and go into IT managment. The MBA degree requirements are easy (compared to MS in CSE), and you can do most of it online.

Best of all, you can do like Eyebyte and Nighthawk's manager and go home at 4pm sharp while demanding your employees work overtime.

'Tis the life.

Agreed, I am applying for an IT management job this week, it is the same quals as regular management only you get interesting staff and projects. And your staff are too technical to threaten your position.

Point is you get to hang out with geeks, get paid more then them and don't have to study or work very hard. I am just praying for it.

[eyebyte_atWork]

Agreed, I am applying for an IT management job this week, it is the same quals as regular management only you get interesting staff and projects. And your staff are too technical to threaten your position.

Point is you get to hang out with geeks, get paid more then them and don't have to study or work very hard. I am just praying for it.


As long as you care about the project being done - you cannot got wrong (unlike my manager who seems to only care about not doing anything at all)

[Prozac]

I was wondering if it's still possible to make a career switch to IT. I have no technical background but am comfortable with computers/systems. Liberal arts major though.

Can I still get my foot in the door with certifications, A+ etc?? Any thoughts?
I will hail to you. :worthy:

you can try to apply for a lab assistant (or similar) position at the local university.. they like hiring students and you get on-the-job training too

there will always be a need for IT support, programming, help desk, network administrators/engineers, etc

generally, network admins don't just do computers, they provide "hopefully seamless" connectivity to fax machines, printers, scanners, phone systems, PDAs such as Blackberrys & Treos, and "normal" stuff like email service support and configuration, hardware (PCs and servers) support and documentation creation and maintenenance.

certification is for "show", experience and application of the book knowledge is how you distance yourself from the others in the field... good luck

[25fd]

It’s never too late.
I’d suggest going for some one year (half a year) IT program that focuses on the practical. Once you have both IT and business you have many more options. I have the MCSD certification but it didn’t help me much to be honest. As a general rule any switch is possible as long as you are committed to it. Ultimately, enthusiasm and passion about the new field is what is going to get you inside.
Stay away from MBA... it’s boring. Go for the future… go for a Master of Strategic Foresight.

[jread]

It’s never too late.
I’d suggest going for some one year (half a year) IT program that focuses on the practical. Once you have both IT and business you have many more options. I have the MCSD certification but it didn’t help me much to be honest. As a general rule any switch is possible as long as you are committed to it. Ultimately, enthusiasm and passion about the new field is what is going to get you inside.
Stay away from MBA... it’s boring. Go for the future… go for a Master of Strategic Foresight.

This is the degree I was looking at before. Seems to be a 50/50 blend of technical courses and IT management: Master of Science in Computer Information Systems (http://www.stedwards.edu/business/graduate/mscis/curriculum.htm)

[25fd]

This is the degree I was looking at before. Seems to be a 50/50 blend of technical courses and IT management: Master of Science in Computer Information Systems (http://www.stedwards.edu/business/graduate/mscis/curriculum.htm)

It sounds ok. A lot of data oriented courses, which is not bad. There are a lot of Data Warehousing consulting opportunities in the corporate world. Very INTP oriented (big picture, troubleshooting, concepts, dealing with processes) up to a point when it becomes very detail oriented.

Another option is to do your research pick 3-4 companies you would like to work for and then do some networking. Set up a few information interviews with people doing the job. It’s not hard. Most people are pleased to share their experiences. You can learn a LOT from information interviews.
It could be a better option to just get a job in one of these companies then later on when you are in IT (or where you want to be) take an advanced degree and have the company help you with the tuition. You will be making money this time and learning about the business. You get paid not for what you know but for what you can do with what you know.



Take my advice with a grain of salt. I may be biased since I don’t like “jobs”. I hate unions, benefits, taxes, job security, government jobs, and all those things the SJ world likes and needs. Schools only prepare you to become a good employee. The most I can do is consulting, but it’s still called “working for money”. If I don’t go to work I don’t make money. The goal should be to have the “money work for you”. This way if you don’t go to work you still make money. Use your abilities and creating/critical thinking to find a solution to having “the money work for you”. I hope this helps.

[jread]

It sounds ok. A lot of data oriented courses, which is not bad. There are a lot of Data Warehousing consulting opportunities in the corporate world. Very INTP oriented (big picture, troubleshooting, concepts, dealing with processes) up to a point when it becomes very detail oriented.

Another option is to do your research pick 3-4 companies you would like to work for and then do some networking. Set up a few information interviews with people doing the job. It’s not hard. Most people are pleased to share their experiences. You can learn a LOT from information interviews.
It could be a better option to just get a job in one of these companies then later on when you are in IT (or where you want to be) take an advanced degree and have the company help you with the tuition. You will be making money this time and learning about the business. You get paid not for what you know but for what you can do with what you know.



Take my advice with a grain of salt. I may be biased since I don’t like “jobs”. I hate unions, benefits, taxes, job security, government jobs, and all those things the SJ world likes and needs. Schools only prepare you to become a good employee. The most I can do is consulting, but it’s still called “working for money”. If I don’t go to work I don’t make money. The goal should be to have the “money work for you”. This way if you don’t go to work you still make money. Use your abilities and creating/critical thinking to find a solution to having “the money work for you”. I hope this helps.

Good post :)

I have worked in local government for 9 years now, 6 of them at my current place of employment. I like working for local government in a big city because there is a very wide variety of jobs within the same organization. I can move around to whatever I want to do and still keep my vacation, sick leave, retirement, etc. I became vested last year and would like to stay here if possible.

I've talked to the IT guys in my office as well as the urban planners. Both jobs sound like a lot of fun and I'm setup to go either direction in the future. I work in Geographic Information Systems, which is a hybrid of IT and Geography. It's kind of a "which way to go now" situation for me.

I did completely repair my home network last night, got all file sharing to run smoothly and got the network printer to work from both computers. I know this is the "tip of the iceberg" but damn, it was fun. I had a great feeling of satisfaction when I finished it all and everything worked perfectly with no problems... and I did it all on my own with no help. I thought, "I could definitely do this for a living". However, what would be even better would be to come up with nifty IT business solutions and then make someone else do all the dirty work :D

[25fd]

Good post :)

I have worked in local government for 9 years now, 6 of them at my current place of employment. I like working for local government in a big city because there is a very wide variety of jobs within the same organization. I can move around to whatever I want to do and still keep my vacation, sick leave, retirement, etc. I became vested last year and would like to stay here if possible.

I've talked to the IT guys in my office as well as the urban planners. Both jobs sound like a lot of fun and I'm setup to go either direction in the future. I work in Geographic Information Systems, which is a hybrid of IT and Geography. It's kind of a "which way to go now" situation for me.

I did completely repair my home network last night, got all file sharing to run smoothly and got the network printer to work from both computers. I know this is the "tip of the iceberg" but damn, it was fun. I had a great feeling of satisfaction when I finished it all and everything worked perfectly with no problems... and I did it all on my own with no help. I thought, "I could definitely do this for a living". However, what would be even better would be to come up with nifty IT business solutions and then make someone else do all the dirty work :D


I know the feeling. Although I work in marketing I still build my own computers, and program from time to time. Just that I call it a hobby. I recommend reading this book “Think and Grow Rich” by Napoleon Hill. You never know what dormant talents and ideas could awake in you.

[jread]

I know the feeling. Although I work in marketing I still build my own computers, and program from time to time. Just that I call it a hobby. I recommend reading this book “Think and Grow Rich” by Napoleon Hill. You never know what dormant talents and ideas could awake in you.

Thanks, I will check out the book :)

[Nighthawk]

I recommend reading this book “Think and Grow Rich” by Napoleon Hill. You never know what dormant talents and ideas could awake in you.



Thanks, I will check out the book :)

As will I.

[jread]

As will I.

The reviews look excellent. Can't wait to get a copy of this one :)

[Nighthawk]

The reviews look excellent. Can't wait to get a copy of this one :)

Yes ... amazing that it was written over 60 years ago.

[Stillwater]

I recommend reading this book “Think and Grow Rich” by Napoleon Hill. You never know what dormant talents and ideas could awake in you.

I've been meaning to read this one for some time now. Once I get over the procrastination, I'm home free. I have a backlog of 5 other books to read, should I really buy another?

[Nighthawk]

I have a backlog of 5 other books to read, should I really buy another?

Books are cool. Go for it! ;) Two entire walls of my study are bookshelves filled to the brim.

[aether]

Lots to think about and read about, thanks.

[25fd]

A coworker (ESTP) introduced me to "rich dad and poor dad" books. I've always stayed away from "get rich” books. But one day I took a look at the book from courtesy to my coworker. I opened it at random and read for some time. Suddenly most of what I was reading looked like common sense to me. Needless to say I bought a few books from the “rich dad poor dad” collection. That's where I learned about the "think and grow rich" book. I have been looking for a mentor for some time and I found not one but many in books like “think and grow rich”.
Recently, I am enjoying an audio book (I listen to even at work) named “Before you quit your job: 10 real-life lessons every entrepreneur should know about building a multimillion-dollar business)” by Robert Kiyosaki. Although, I am skeptical of anything that the mainstream likes, sometimes, there is real value in what is popular. "Think and grow rich” is such exception.

[Tolbruk]

Unless its a programming language that fills in a niche and is in high demand, I would avoid this area of IT. The best areas for growth appear to be project management, because, someone still needs to be onsight and man the ship / direct projects whether they are a small 2 man project or a behemoth 60 person implementation.

Programmers are easily outsourced. The other option is infrastructure support (servers, networking, etc.), which can be outsourced to some degree, but seems (to me at least) less susceptible to outsourcing.

[DevRock]

A coworker (ESTP) introduced me to "rich dad and poor dad" books. I've always stayed away from "get rich” books. But one day I took a look at the book from courtesy to my coworker. I opened it at random and read for some time. Suddenly most of what I was reading looked like common sense to me. Needless to say I bought a few books from the “rich dad poor dad” collection. That's where I learned about the "think and grow rich" book. I have been looking for a mentor for some time and I found not one but many in books like “think and grow rich”.
Recently, I am enjoying an audio book (I listen to even at work) named “Before you quit your job: 10 real-life lessons every entrepreneur should know about building a multimillion-dollar business)” by Robert Kiyosaki. Although, I am skeptical of anything that the mainstream likes, sometimes, there is real value in what is popular. "Think and grow rich” is such exception.

I 100% agree. I'm reading his "Before You Quit Your Job" book right now, actually, since I'm launching my own IT consulting biz. It's something EVERYONE who wants to work on their own MUST read.

His very first book completely changed the way I viewed money, investing, life, etc. And for the better. I dont' buy into all the other stuff they shill, as I think it's borderline garbage. But, just one of those books can change the way you see things.

[noise]

If you need to make money while making the switch an entry level tech support position is easy to get. DO NOT get stuck working tech support for long under any circumstances.

Positions I have held so far in chronological order

Tech Support
Network Analyst
Developer
Project Manager
Developer
System Administrator
Developer
System Administrator
Developer



I keep coming back to development because it is what I enjoy the most. I come back to administration for position availability for what I like to be paid. I also feel that making the rounds in other positions only helps me as a developer in the long run. Being well rounded in IT is very important if you want to make it to the better positions. It also lets you find other positions more quickly. Turnover is a fact of life in IT as projects/departments/companies rise and fall very rapidly in this field.

[Ivy]

If you need to make money while making the switch an entry level tech support position is easy to get. DO NOT get stuck working tech support for long under any circumstances.

Positions I have held so far in chronological order

Tech Support
Network Analyst
Developer
Project Manager
Developer
System Administrator
Developer
System Administrator
Developer



I keep coming back to development because it is what I enjoy the most. I come back to administration for position availability for what I like to be paid. I also feel that making the rounds in other positions only helps me as a developer in the long run. Being well rounded in IT is very important if you want to make it to the better positions. It also lets you find other positions more quickly. Turnover is a fact of life in IT as projects/departments/companies rise and fall very rapidly in this field.

That last sentence is so true. I'm not in IT, but my husband and brother are (both MCSEs, brother is a trainer as well). They have each stayed in any given position for around 3 years, max. It's not a field where you generally get into a position and stay there for decades (although, I do know of exceptions).

[eyebyte_atWork]

I keep coming back to development because it is what I enjoy the most. I come back to administration for position availability for what I like to be paid. I also feel that making the rounds in other positions only helps me as a developer in the long run. Being well rounded in IT is very important if you want to make it to the better positions. It also lets you find other positions more quickly. Turnover is a fact of life in IT as projects/departments/companies rise and fall very rapidly in this field.


Funny thing is... that if you ever find yourself under the microscope of a courtroom they will judge your character badly because of your "inability to keep a job". This is the sad side to this field. Most of the time it is perfect for this reason. I too have worked for over a dozen companies in the last 10 years.

[noise]

Funny thing is... that if you ever find yourself under the microscope of a courtroom they will judge your character badly because of your "inability to keep a job". This is the sad side to this field. Most of the time it is perfect for this reason. I too have worked for over a dozen companies in the last 10 years.

Baseless character assassination is always a problem in court.

[eyebyte_atWork]

Baseless character assassination is always a problem in court.


And it really sux when a judge buys it (being that alot of judges are SJ's its not hard to see them thinking that)

[Ferrus]

Baseless character assassination is always a problem in court.
All part of the fun, heh (unless your the one being character assassinated)

[noise]

And it really sux when a judge buys it (being that alot of judges are SJ's its not hard to see them thinking that)

Divorce court?

Arena of Lies