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Thread: INTPs and ENFPs

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    Default INTPs and ENFPs

    Let me start by saying that I don't think that everyone is the exactly the same as their respective descriptions in the MBTI personality profile. As an ENFP, I do see many of my characteristics in my profile, but not all of them.

    I have an INTP friend who constantly accuses me of doing or thinking ridiculous things I never even cared about or noticed. When I tell him my thoughts on the matter, he vehemently opposes and insists that I am "bsing my thoughts." He says this because he "read" about "ENFPs substituting their own realities" in this forum. He refuses to believe that I'm actually telling the truth, just because my truth does not incriminate me. He keeps insisting that I'm just trying to be righteous, when I honestly am righteous in his false accusation. He says I have no "concrete proof" on my thoughts. Really, how does someone offer proof when telling their feelings? One of my biggest pet peeves is injustice of any degree. I get furious when someone or I am being wrongly accused. I wish I was one of those people who dismisses an accusation when they know it's wrong, but I am not. I know and admit when I am wrong, and hate injustice against myself. After all, the ability to recognize and accept my faults is one of the reasons why my boyfriend, who is an INTP, and I get along so well without any unnecessary arguments. It is also one of my proudest achievements in refining who I am as a person. Oh, because I am "bsing my thoughts," I am apparently a "typical ENFP."

    Generally, are INTPs unable to accept when something deviates from the preconceived truth? Do they substitute their own reality to satisfy themselves, even if it borderlines insanity?

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    woah. Are you one of my ex-girlfriends?

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    Rofl. [on OP]

    "Generally, are INTPs unable to accept when something deviates from the preconceived truth? Do they substitute their own reality to satisfy themselves, even if it borderlines insanity?"

    Unfortunately yes to both >_> For myself at least.

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    seriously, any thread about INTPs and ENFPs should be renamed "Mortal Kombat".

    Most INTPs will begrudgingly concede a point if they know they're wrong.

    By BSing your thoughts, he may not mean that you're full of shit, just that you're just filtering shit in order to enforce your side of whatever argument or dispute. In your mind, you may be thinking completely rationally, but you have to understand that an ENFP and an INTP's views of "facts" may be different shades of gray.

    We're running on different GUIs.

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    I do realize that our views are different. But you see, he asked me for my thoughts. How would he even know if I'm "filtering" things out or not. The accusations are beyond ridiculous, though. He accused me of "attacking" him, when I barely talk to him and could care less. He then asked me if one of my closest friends are gay, and when I answered "no, he is liking a girl right now," he refused to believe it because I didn't provide "concrete examples." I really don't know what kind of examples or proof he is looking for for these types of questions.

    My boyfriend is an INTP, and we never have these types of problems.

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    Quote Originally Posted by no1012 View Post
    Generally, are INTPs unable to accept when something deviates from the preconceived truth? Do they substitute their own reality to satisfy themselves, even if it borderlines insanity?
    No, if you make a good case for your position, an INTP should be very receptive to their own fallibility. If you're just talking out your arse with nothing of note to back you up, expect to be greeted with disdain.
    “Even the journalist from Zoo magazine was puzzled as to why condoms should be distributed prior to a fancy sit-down meal.”

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    I usually don't argue unless I have substantial evidence; that is, when it comes to fact-based things like science. But I really have no idea how to provide evidence when it comes to my feelings and thoughts, other than outright expressing them. Please enlighten me on what kind of evidence INTPs look for in these types of situations.

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    I would say anything that doesn't have a potential for being biased. Most people are biased so most communication from people needs to be analyzed for biases. The intp in question seems to have identified your information to be biased (whether correct or not). However, these things are often situational and in a calm state he may be more willing to accept your interpretation of your feelings on a matter biased or not. Nothing is as concrete as can be described on an internet forum or an MBTI profile and hopefully he can/should understand that. He may have been trying to explain his point of view of basically not being able to take even your own description of your own feelings at face value. By explaining that its possible for people to be biased even without knowing it or even about something as personal as their own thoughts and feelings. But in the heat of the moment it probably didn't come off very well. I'm certainly not good at presenting my ideas when calm let alone when im angry about something.

    Maybe, im in the right ballpark here but maybe not.

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    XNTPs are variations on a theme where they share such with XNFPs. This core difference covers that of facts vs values.

    An ENFP is a variation on an ENTP as is an INFP a variation on an INTP.

    The XNFP has a purpose associated with issues of completion (identity seeking) as compared to the XNTP with a purpose on problem solving through some enticing, 'wooing', perspective (new paradigm etc).

    XNFPs keep coming back to, begin with, states described by analogy with some sort of 'return' or 'repetition' - a cyclic focus and so covering symmetry issues (that get into identity seeking)

    XNTPs keep coming back to, begin with, states described by analogy with 'birthing', the incubation of an idea etc etc. and so associated enthusiasm in focusing on possibles (expectations and so formal planning etc) and use of foresight.

    The 'mud' from which the XNTP emerges is described by analogy to states of
    'bringing something into the light' where this bringing forth needs to be precise, factual, clear for it to be accepted.

    OTOH the 'mud' from which the XNFP emerges is described by analogy to states of quality control as infrastructure is set up (and so a sense of devotion to such an act) - this brings out a critical aspect with a qualitative and so values focus.

    In relational space the mix of fact and values bring out the team benefits when the NF and NT turn to solve problems, establish identities. If their differences are not accepted then when they turn to face each other there can be issues.

    As such their 'sameness' is through their passion in what they do - whether problem solving or identity seeking. This sameness reflects the cooperative aspects of the relationship - the competitive aspects are in the differences of facts focus vs values focus.

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    He may have been trying to explain his point of view of basically not being able to take even your own description of your own feelings at face value.

    Maybe, im in the right ballpark here but maybe not.
    It's funny that you said that, because he wholeheartedly declared that he saw "enough of the story to make an accurate assessment" that my intentions were meant to harm. I felt like he tried to impose the idea that ENFPs make up their own realities where everything is right on me under any circumstances. After telling me that I'm lying to myself, he sent me a link to a post on this forum, with the topic being "ENFPs make up their own realities." I sure hope that not all INTPs are like this. I think he might just be obsessed with the MBTI and tries to live it out to a T.

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